So called dieselpunk

[maze.rodent]

Tell me more! Also, I should look this up myself, but does anybody know at what point in the development of a potential aeroplane does the FAA and Federal law start to take an interest?

An aircraft is classified as an ultralight, and is not subject to FAA regulation if, generally speaking it is;

Single seat (solo only)
Weighs less than 254 pounds
Has a fuel capacity of 5 gallons or less
Has a top speed of 63 mph (55 knots)
Has a stall speed of less than 28 mph (24 knots)

For a full treatment of this see-FAR Part 103.
Technically, if your aircraft conforms to the above specifications, as far as the FAA is concerned, it is not an airplane, and they don't care...sort of the "moped of the air."

Come to think of it, real pilots don't consider them to be airplanes, either...they call them "death-kites."

Thistlewaite

well, then technically a solo airship incapable of said speed, with said fuel capacity is an "ultra-light" being lighter than air, and not stalling.  heck, if it was electric or pedal, speed would be your only worry.

i must try this...

[Wells45]

I share the love of Art Deco as others here. I'm lucky that the State Fair of Texas, which is in my area, has the largest collection of exterior Art Deco murals in the US.
 
I would think that "A Detective Story" in Animatrix is a good example of Dieselpunk. "The Shadow," especially the movie, would also be considered Dieselpunk.

[Callis]

Wouldn't the topic of Zeppelins depend on the design as to whether or not it is dieselpunk or steampunk? I mean the first Zeppelin flight took place in 1900. Even though it subsequently failed 18 minutes after takeoff, it still flew in the Victorian era. It's designs came from the late 1800's which would lead me to believe that it couldn't be dieselpunk. Info I've found on "Diesel" engines being licensed and produced much less used in any sort of transportation seems to be a bit shoddy but what I've found shows the first diesel aero engines were in the late 20's.

Now to me that makes the whole argument so convoluted that you could argue it to death and both sides could still be right. Zeppelins were dieselpunk. They were also produced and flown before the introduction of diesel aero engines.

[akumabito]

Tell me more! Also, I should look this up myself, but does anybody know at what point in the development of a potential aeroplane does the FAA and Federal law start to take an interest?

An aircraft is classified as an ultralight, and is not subject to FAA regulation if, generally speaking it is;

Single seat (solo only)
Weighs less than 254 pounds
Has a fuel capacity of 5 gallons or less
Has a top speed of 63 mph (55 knots)
Has a stall speed of less than 28 mph (24 knots)

For a full treatment of this see-FAR Part 103.
Technically, if your aircraft conforms to the above specifications, as far as the FAA is concerned, it is not an airplane, and they don't care...sort of the "moped of the air."

Come to think of it, real pilots don't consider them to be airplanes, either...they call them "death-kites."

Thistlewaite

well, then technically a solo airship incapable of said speed, with said fuel capacity is an "ultra-light" being lighter than air, and not stalling.  heck, if it was electric or pedal, speed would be your only worry.

i must try this...

Except an airship or balloon does have weight. The fact the lifting agent eliminates this weight is irrelevant.
Hence only the smallest balloons being classified as such. They are weighed without whatever it is that makes 'm fly, so without being filled with hot air or helium..

[markf]

Tell me more! Also, I should look this up myself, but does anybody know at what point in the development of a potential aeroplane does the FAA and Federal law start to take an interest?

An aircraft is classified as an ultralight, and is not subject to FAA regulation if, generally speaking it is;
Single seat (solo only)
Weighs less than 254 pounds
Has a fuel capacity of 5 gallons or less
Has a top speed of 63 mph (55 knots)
Has a stall speed of less than 28 mph (24 knots)

For a full treatment of this see-FAR Part 103.
Technically, if your aircraft conforms to the above specifications, as far as the FAA is concerned, it is not an airplane, and they don't care...sort of the "moped of the air."

Come to think of it, real pilots don't consider them to be airplanes, either...they call them "death-kites."

Thistlewaite

well, then technically a solo airship incapable of said speed, with said fuel capacity is an "ultra-light" being lighter than air, and not stalling.  heck, if it was electric or pedal, speed would be your only worry.

i must try this...

Except an airship or balloon does have weight. The fact the lifting agent eliminates this weight is irrelevant.
Hence only the smallest balloons being classified as such. They are weighed without whatever it is that makes 'm fly, so without being filled with hot air or helium..

Aku is 100% correct. In the USA at least ultralights are classified by their non-inflated dry weight on the ground, including the empty envelope and propane tank.  This is why my former ultralight hot air 'chair balloon' had to have a relatively small envelope, which made it trickier to fly (in the sense of responsive flight characteristics) than one with a larger envelope.  markf

[Sir Henry Tolvaddon]

*Puts shilling in the pot*

Steampunk: eccentric inventors are generally good, energy is from clockwork and steam, the aristocracy are still just hanging on to power, brass and wood are the materials of choice, can involve werewolves and vampires, the era of the amateur

Deiselpunk: eccentric inventers are now generally "mad professors" fighting good "industrialists", energy is from petroleum with hints of nuclear, the professional politicians are in power, steel and aluminium are the materials of choice, can involve demons and devils, the era of the professional

generally.....

[Wells45]

I would add Raiders of the Lost Ark as being Dieselpunk.

[von Adler]

I would add Raiders of the Lost Ark as being Dieselpunk.

That's a bit of a problem with dieselpunk: not many things considered disel actually are or have been such. Raiders is a pretty straight-up example of two-fisted adventure pulp, of the sort written in 30's to 50's; of course, you could argue adventure pulp being a sort of proto-dieselpunk, like scientific romacences are often considered proto-steampunk (whether that's an accurate or even fair assessment is another thing; I think Cory would most vehemently disagree with the notion, if he still were around).

[darkshines]

See, I seem to be trapped between worlds. I love the Victorian era, its literature etc, but I adore the 1920-40s too. Despite steam and clockwork still being the predominant power sources at the time, I am told I am "not steampunk" for prefering that era of dress.

[Wells45]

See, I seem to be trapped between worlds. I love the Victorian era, its literature etc, but I adore the 1920-40s too. Despite steam and clockwork still being the predominant power sources at the time, I am told I am "not steampunk" for prefering that era of dress.

I love both eras as well. In fact, I think I dress circa 20's -40's more often than Victorian. This get's back to what defines steampunk. While there's common elements to steampunk fashion (goggles, hat, pocketwatch...), and if I was going to go to a LARP or Cosplay I would take great care to be very Victorian, I'm pretty sure there's not a "dress code" for being considered "steampunk."

[Atterton]

Being a man a victorian suit would probably be okay, but victorian women´s clothes seems very impractical for many things. Also, it covers up too many of the fun bits. For that reason I´d rather see a revival of people wearing 1940s clothes instead of 1890s.

[steamtastic]

Being a man a victorian suit would probably be okay, but victorian women´s clothes seems very impractical for many things. Also, it covers up too many of the fun bits. For that reason I´d rather see a revival of people wearing 1940s clothes instead of 1890s.

agreed. 

[insanity assasin]

It must be stated that , to some extant , diesel punk is the slightly more modern child of steampunk , so perhaps a bit of overlap is to be expected...

[von Corax]

I have always (for a relatively small value of "always") considered Dieselpunk to be an evolutionary offshoot/continuation of Steampunk, rather than a distinct, separate concept.

[darkshines]

I'm 1940s to the HILT today, veiled fascinator, red lips, high waist pencil skirt and seamed stockings. I feel beautiful ^_^

[Haywire]

Dieselpunk = industrial but with intelligence?

I like it a lot better than steampunk in both aesthetic and attitude. We don't have to wear fancy dresses or have tea parties but we can still be evil scientists obsessed with the inner workings of machinery. Sounds good to me!

One question though: are you guys sure the term wasn't invented to get rid of the "less polite" steampunks?

We can do what we want with the term "steampunk" and I don't think putting everyone who isn't elegant and mannerly into the "dieselpunk" ghetto is very nice. Dieselpunk is as steampunk as steampunk.

[Jonny B. Goode]

Really can't say much here other than what's already been said. I'm a dieselpunk myself; I was a dieselpunk before I even knew there was such a thing. Fedoras, wingtips, spectators, zoot suits, raybans.

I wrote the following distinction, for a group I started which encorporates both:

Do you enjoy the novels of Jules Verne and H.G. Wells? Wish you had lived in those times? Or wonder... what if those times were now? Or what if the Information Age had started back then? Do you like the fantasy world of the Wild Wild West or The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen? The high tech that never was? Enjoy dressing in period clothing, enjoy the romance and manners of a time gone by? Top hats and waistcoats, corsets and bustles? Or perhaps you're a craftsman working in brass and wood, steam and gears. Then you might be a steampunk.

Or maybe you like the smell of oil and diesel, the buzz and lights of the big city. Maybe fedoras and wing tips are your thing? Or maybe zoot suits? Love the cool sounds of jazz, blues and swing? Enjoy the hard-boiled noir of Sam Spade and Philip Marlowe, and action-packed pulp comics featuring spacemen and rocketeers? Art Deco, and cars the way they used to be made, the way a car should be made? Is it the year 2000, and you're wondering "where's my flying car?" Wondering where's the Tomorrowland you were promised yesterday? Then you might be a dieselpunk.

Btw if you're a dieselpunk like me, you might want to check out Dieselpunks.org.

[Atterton]

Same genre, different time.

Do you know of any computer fonts which have that thin lettering you see for that time period?

[darkshines]

But I love the novels of Jules Verne and H.G. Wells, and "Wish you had lived in those times? Or wonder... what if those times were now?", the high tech that never was, I enjoy dressing in period clothing, and the romance and manners of a time gone by, ESPECIALLY Top hats and waistcoats, corsets and bustles. And I am indeed a craftsman working in brass and wood, steam and gears. So then I might be a steampunk.

BUT

Fedoras and wing tips are also my thing, or perhaps more accurately pearls, feathers a sequins.... and I do love the cool sounds of jazz, blues and swing, so does that make me a dieselpunk?

I adore both, and can happily dip into both.

[Atterton]

Forget the subcultures and just enjoy the genres. I can happily watch Star Trek without feeling I need to hang out with people dressed in Starfleet uniform.

[Dieselcat]

See, I seem to be trapped between worlds. I love the Victorian era, its literature etc, but I adore the 1920-40s too. Despite steam and clockwork still being the predominant power sources at the time, I am told I am "not steampunk" for prefering that era of dress.

I know the feeling! Really I do! The love for both cannot be easily expressed at the same time.

[Klynt Mahryd]

I think you can be both steampunk and dieselpunk at the same time, without being a "heretic" to both. They go together like chocolate and peanut butter!

[Utini420]

It might be a side-affect of being an American and thus not overly concerned with British Royalty, but I've never really felt the hard cut-off between the two.  Hats got smaller, maybe, but its always seemed to me that once you go bogus history all bets are off anyway. 

[Atterton]

There´s a big change in science and technology though. Suddenly you have relativity, radioactivity, atoms, x-rays.

[Dieselcat]

And Art Deco! (So stylish and modern!)