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Author Topic: Covid-19 facts, fallacies, and prepardness  (Read 6755 times)
Deimos
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****
United States United States


aka Countess Millicent Addlewood


« Reply #25 on: March 13, 2020, 09:59:01 pm »

Turns out that my hobbies were pretty useful for the current situation.
When working with wood or metals (and also in the yard) I use a mask with P100 filters.
When using spray paints or soldering/brazing I use the same mask with the Charcoal filters.

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Half-Facepiece-Reusable-Respirator-Assembly-6191-07001-AAD-P100-Small-24-EA-Case/?N=5002385+3294759262&preselect=3293786499&rt=rud

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Organic-Vapor-Cartridge-6001-60-EA-Case/?N=5002385+3294780292&rt=rud

I have several masks and a stock of both types of filters that I bought (months ago) in bulk on Amazon.
Keeping the charcoal ones if the fridge (or freezer) extends their life.

Am I wearing them? No, but it's good to know that I have them, should I need them.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2020, 10:22:26 pm by Deimos » Logged

Here is a test to find out if your mission in life is complete:
If you're alive, it isn't. -- Lauren Bacall

"You can tell a man's vices by his friends, his virtues by his enemies."

"Only the paranoid survive."
Synistor 303
Snr. Officer
****
Australia Australia


Zenyna Ironbracker


« Reply #26 on: March 14, 2020, 02:20:19 am »

Ditto, Deimos, I have mild asthma which is irritated by smoke and chemical-type pollutants (fly spray) so I have a good mask or two at my disposal, but I won't be wearing it much - prefer to stay at home.
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Prof Marvel
Zeppelin Captain
*****
United States United States


learn from history, or be doomed to repeat it


« Reply #27 on: March 14, 2020, 03:11:38 am »

Turns out that my hobbies were pretty useful for the current situation.
When working with wood or metals (and also in the yard) I use a mask with P100 filters.
When using spray paints or soldering/brazing I use the same mask with the Charcoal filters.

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Half-Facepiece-Reusable-Respirator-Assembly-6191-07001-AAD-P100-Small-24-EA-Case/?N=5002385+3294759262&preselect=3293786499&rt=rud

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Organic-Vapor-Cartridge-6001-60-EA-Case/?N=5002385+3294780292&rt=rud

I have several masks and a stock of both types of filters that I bought (months ago) in bulk on Amazon.
Keeping the charcoal ones if the fridge (or freezer) extends their life.

Am I wearing them? No, but it's good to know that I have them, should I need them.

As a semi-professional user of HazMat equipment, including HazMat suits, pressurized breathing systems, NBC rated Military Gas Masks,
Industrial Full Masks, Industrial Half Masks, and a variety of disposable masks, I have some thought to offer.

These half-mask styles are my go-to for both nasty dust ( re: ancient attics and crawlspaces possible laden with dried droppings) and vapors.
they seal very well and filters (as you mention) are replaceable. If required, one can modify the edge seals with soft foam rod for better fit/comfort.

With goggles and the correct cartridge they can be used for everything up to and including toxic dusts and certain toxic vapors.
No filter mask will save you from toxic gasses and/or a lack of oxygen.

If one is in a bind one can fabricate replacement filters using the correct "non-woven cloth", or the membrane used in 3M allergy or hepa furnace filters.
Activated charcoal can be sourced from many places, especially aquarium & fish pond supply houses and scavanged from whole house water filters.

AS MAKERS I actually expect people to be amenable to testing, modifying and creating.

Whilst I agree with Monsieur Bailey that bandannas are useless and many masks "leak like sieves", I must reply with my trademarked phrase

It Depends (tm)

Actual effectiveness of ANY DIY product comes down to YOUR skills.

Leakage can be lessened or completely avoided by sealing the edges with tape.
Yup. Tape all edges to your face.

A largish mask with a valve, well fitted, and taped as required has always worked well for me,  in an environment where the "test" was a VERY strong stench.
The breathing air was clean, but the eyes still burned, thus indicating the need for a full face mask. Which I also have.

NOTE: ANY facial hair can or will compromise the seal.

So, as always,
- use at you own risk
- Your milage may vary
- Don't shoot the messenger
- play nice
-Above all else do no harm

PS: for these purposes, we are not trying to completely cleanse breathing air from a widespread toxic atmosphere.
we are only trying to block aspirated moisture droplets from a person sneezing. Huge difference from an engineering perspective.
this is why almost all surgical masks (which btw are N95 rated) , even tho they are not sealed, keep both patient and doctor reasonably protected.
Oh, and shield your eyes with glasses, goggles, etc. If the agent is coming directly or nearly directly, common wraparounds or safety glasses
with eyeshields do an incredibly good job. We are trying to prevent direct contact from the droplets.

And wear gloves or wash hands.

yhs
prof mumbles
« Last Edit: March 14, 2020, 04:09:00 am by Prof Marvel » Logged

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von Corax
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« Reply #28 on: March 14, 2020, 04:33:49 am »

I realize that many will say I couldn't possibly be serious or correct, but the quite simple matter is that the first three were and are designed to keep one from breathing one's contagion all over one's fellows.
And so are still worth wearing if you can't find anything better. Stopping oneself from spreading it (especially in the contagious, pre-symptom phase) is a key part of the Delay Strategy.

Never said it wasn't. Just said that they won't stop the virus from being inhaled by the wearer. At all.

Yes, but it isn't an airborne contagion, unless someone actually coughs at you.
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Prof Marvel
Zeppelin Captain
*****
United States United States


learn from history, or be doomed to repeat it


« Reply #29 on: March 14, 2020, 05:27:22 am »

I realize that many will say I couldn't possibly be serious or correct, but the quite simple matter is that the first three were and are designed to keep one from breathing one's contagion all over one's fellows.

And so are still worth wearing if you can't find anything better. Stopping oneself from spreading it (especially in the contagious, pre-symptom phase) is a key part of the Delay Strategy.


Never said it wasn't. Just said that they won't stop the virus from being inhaled by the wearer. At all.


Yes, but it isn't an airborne contagion, unless someone actually coughs at you.



EVEN IF the disease vector coughs at you, it is only a temporary spray of airborne mist.
Blocking and filtering that is significantly easier than trying to filter breathable air from a cloud of pollen/dust/chemical vapors.

when dealing with a temporary localized spray, backward facing tiny gaps in the face mask are less significant.

Please remember that we are only trying to provide a physical barrier and filter a few ppm from a temporary spray .  (see NIH article below)

In Monsieur Bailey's case (and my nasty dusty attic ) he is trying to continuously filter out up to 10-15 GRAMS of pollen PER METER .
I have yet to be able to measure the level of dust in my litttle attic of horror.

here is a discussion of various pollutants invcluding bacteria and viruses.
http://vair-monitor.com/2017/01/03/dust-pollution-overview/

and here is a handy chart


AHA here we go, these folks tell it better than I do:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3119883/

"Influenza A viruses (IAVs) are transmitted through direct contact, indirect contact, large respiratory droplets and droplet nuclei (aerosols) that are left behind by the evaporation of larger droplets. The relative importance of each of these routes remains contentious. The aerosol transmission route has been particularly controversial since there is scant direct proof of infection mediated by virus-laden aerosols, partly owing to the difficulties in studies involving human subjects and partly owing to the challenges in detecting IAVs in ambient air .

Virus-laden aerosols may be released into air when infected people cough, sneeze, talk or breathe; however, the aerosols are quickly diluted by ambient air to extremely low concentrations.."

So, just by washing hands and not touching your face we block direct and indirect contact, which is the most usual method of infection.
By properly wearing a surgical mask we first stop touching our face ! Second we block large droplets, and aerosols. Finally the arosols quickly dispers so
contagion becomes either arithmetically or logarithmically more remote per second depending upon wind.

Then from a statistical engineering point of view getting even an only 80-90 percent effective facemask is significantly better than "none".
and Finally , due to the known method of spreading, the experts are ALL saying
- don't touch people ( japanese bowing is in!)
- stay 2 meters away from others
- wash hands frequently
- don't touch your face, eyes, mouth
- sneeze or cough into a tissue or your shirt elbow
- did I mention wash your hands?

if you want to wear a mask, do so.
pay attention as to how you put it on and take it off.

BTW the common surgical masks I got from CVS and Walgreens pharmacy 2 years ago ARE N95 masks.  If I use them , I tape the edges to my face.
      I preferr the valved N95 sanding, dust & etc masks becasue the fit is better.

I personally am spraying my mask and my Fedora with 70% alcohol when I get home.
then I take off my gloves (inside out) bag them and throw them in the trash.

so, just saying , monsieur Bailey is correct with his emprical results, but they are not necessarily relevant to a low-concentration airborne virus.

yhs
prof marvel
« Last Edit: March 14, 2020, 06:10:50 am by Prof Marvel » Logged
J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #30 on: March 14, 2020, 06:39:59 am »

Then again, we need to deal with the elephant in the room: human behavior. All of those facts and recommendations will not matter if you have to go out and fight hordes of angry orcs just to get your daily bacon. Below is a perfect example of panic. This is what I had to confront when I left work and decided to step into the local supermarket.

THERE IS NO FOOD ON THE SHELVES.

It's very disheartening to see the local supermarkets. I guess this is my WTF for the day. I'm now more afraid of people than I am of the stupid virus. As I found out today, even if you think you are prepared, the great unwashed masses will make sure your plans fail. By that I mean that if you think you'll be able to go buy a 3-week supply of food, you got another thing coming.  The collective behavior of people, may be more dangerous that the virus. If you didn't buy food last week, you can't build your stash now. In fact, if you did not build your stash, and were innocently expecting to find food like you always do, you're also are out of luck. You will need to borrow food from a neighbor or take more drastic measures, which implies you can't self-isolate, because you now face long hours, and probably days of food hunting. .

The images were taken by yours truly a few hours ago (about 9 pm at night) con my preferred super, located in an upper middle class neighborhood full with college professor, professionals and college students. It's not a fancy millionaires neighborhood, but it's well to do. All semblance of humanity faded away today and the fangs came out.









The supermarkets have been emptied of food. This time it's not toilet paper or beans, it's everything else including ice cream. No raw meats, no cooked meats, only expensive deli cuts and imported cheeses remain on the shelf. All frozen food of any kind, raw or prepared, including vegetables are all gone. I managed to find the last 3 onions and was lucky enough to find 4 boxes of instant rice and 3 cans of spinach.That's the only thing I could find in my regular shopping list. I ended up buying 22 beef patties as a substitute for the minced turkey and beef I buy fresh to cook with. I could not find any chicken nor any fish or seafood.

I was surprised that even the Italian mineral water was routed from the shelves (I was kind of hoping that the small brain of the orcs would lead them to believe Italian mineral water was tainted with Coronavirus). Alas, no such luck, I guess they're smart enough to figure out viruses die in mildlyaacidic carbonated water during transport, and are unlikely to be found in bottled water.









Now, let's put things in perspective. Last week I went ahead and bought 3 times the food I normally buy per week. I usually buy during the weekend and cook for the week. So 3 times the amount of food was not extraordinary nor expensive (just $50. Dirt cheap).

But then I heard from the spread of the virus, and 2 days ago I made up my mind to bump the 3 week stash to at least 5 weeks. Today I got confirmation that experts expect to see a 7 week period begure the crisis begins to diffuse if we do everything right.

The announcement in the local government that city schools would close one week early before the Spring Break (one week vacation period loosely tied to Easter) sent parents into a bezerker flesh eating frenzy that has left most supermarkets looking like this. The announcement today that COVID tests will be free and available in drive-through settings did not allay fears, because people must still show symptoms before they're even allowed to take the test for COVID 19. Hence you will still need to quarantene voluntarily or at the discretion of employers and schools, otherwise you are a walking inoculator.
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Deimos
Snr. Officer
****
United States United States


aka Countess Millicent Addlewood


« Reply #31 on: March 14, 2020, 10:03:53 am »

I'm not one to use extreme profanity, but omg, those pics are effin' scary!

I plan to hit the grocery store(s) later today.... and I have no idea what I'll see (or not see).
I'll let you all know....

Stash update: I actually have several months worth of food: frozen stuff (meat , veggies, pizzas, even ice cream) and  canned/jar stuff...beans, applesauce, fruit, peanut butter, jam, tomatoes, black olives (I love black olives), dry cereal, oatmeal.
Will have to get milk sometime this week, and bread, but I have still have  a dozen+ eggs.
I even have 3 or 4 boxes of biscotti  and a couple  packages of Oreos, and enough tea bags to last 3 months.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2020, 10:15:19 am by Deimos » Logged
MWBailey
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"This is the sort of thing no-one ever believes"

rtafStElmo
« Reply #32 on: March 14, 2020, 10:59:12 am »

I guess some people just aren't familiar with the art of scrounging. Sometimes you have to grab things. Often you have to shop aroound, and be willing to look for what you need in what seem to most folks to be wildly weird and unlikely places. Sometimes you have to tell your current boss to get stuffed if he refuses to let you off to do what you have to do to keep from starving or to keep from compromising your or your family's health. Sometimes you have to make what you need from other things, sometimes to the point of modifying something far out of its normal configuration, or even take things apart and put the parts back together to make other things.

And sometimes, you have to go ahead and cook and eat things that you would normally hate and avoid. That's just the way it is.

I spent the day (Friday) doing personal financial stuff, helping the folks get our famiily's groceries for the lockdown (we anticipated such a thing a week ago and had already started grabbing this and that here and there to build up our supplies of food adn other things) and acquiring acrylic colors and other needed materials .

Somehow, though, we neglected paper towels. Mom was beside herself with worry over it. Funny thing about paper goods, you never think you really need much of them until you are almost out of them. That fact is probably what caused much of the TP strife of the last few days; people having not quite enough and being dependent upon it  for everything from quickie wipe-ups to wound care to what its actually for and other things besides. End result?  Everybody getting all desperate thinking about what might happen if the ravioli goes bad and everybody gets the Anzio Twostep....

Anyway, Mom was so worried about paper towels (like TP, they have a million other uses.You can even use them interchangeably with TP in a pinch) that she even demanded my easel roll that I've been using since late January, and was still moaning about it all in the evening after supper, so I went on a scrounging expedition (other things were needed as well) Remember that movie The Great Escape? How James Garner's character was assigned to be the "scrounger?" Well, that's me around here, nine times out of twenty. Run out of something? Tell MW to go get one or make one from something else.

I could in fact make passable paper towels out of other materials, but most of the ways to do it are long and involved, or involve the old Sears Catalog method, so I went to a store that I happen to know about and found that while the price was of the gouging variety, they did in fact have several large bundles of paper towels, I grabbed one and three or four other things and then booked it back home before the sun had completely set. I was glad, too, because I had begun to get the distinct impression at three separate times that I was being followed. I'm always leery of such in disaster  situations. Most of the people in our part of Houston are upright, good people, but there are a few who whose veneer of civilization is liable to peel off with only the slightest provocation, so...

In any case, I managed to fade all of the people trying to follow me, and made it home without other incident. Mom was overjoyed about not having to resort to using newspapers and Haband catalogs for toweling, and I got my easel roll back. Now, to find a pic of a fluyt...
« Last Edit: March 14, 2020, 11:06:14 am by MWBailey » Logged

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« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2020, 04:15:10 pm »

I'm not one to use extreme profanity, but omg, those pics are effin' scary!

I plan to hit the grocery store(s) later today.... and I have no idea what I'll see (or not see).
I'll let you all know....

Stash update: I actually have several months worth of food: frozen stuff (meat , veggies, pizzas, even ice cream) and  canned/jar stuff...beans, applesauce, fruit, peanut butter, jam, tomatoes, black olives (I love black olives), dry cereal, oatmeal.
Will have to get milk sometime this week, and bread, but I have still have  a dozen+ eggs.
I even have 3 or 4 boxes of biscotti  and a couple  packages of Oreos, and enough tea bags to last 3 months.

And that's only half the photos I took. The whole shop was like this. The did leave 1/2 of the vinegar section untouched though. I took my precious 3 yellow onions and 3 cans of spinach home last night , with about 22 hamburger beef patties, and it turns out that another supermarket (same chain) near where I work in the ghetto part of the city was also very busy, but they still have most of everything. Now I have to decide whether to return the hamburgers and buy what I wanted or just stick to the hamburgers ($20 is still $20, you know). I guess poor people are being more sensible or they are better at restocking the supermarket, because the "educated" crowd are going bezerk.
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2020, 04:35:12 pm »

I guess some people just aren't familiar with the art of scrounging. Sometimes you have to grab things. Often you have to shop aroound, and be willing to look for what you need in what seem to most folks to be wildly weird and unlikely places. Sometimes you have to tell your current boss to get stuffed if he refuses to let you off to do what you have to do to keep from starving or to keep from compromising your or your family's health. Sometimes you have to make what you need from other things, sometimes to the point of modifying something far out of its normal configuration, or even take things apart and put the parts back together to make other things.

And sometimes, you have to go ahead and cook and eat things that you would normally hate and avoid. That's just the way it is.

I spent the day (Friday) doing personal financial stuff, helping the folks get our famiily's groceries for the lockdown (we anticipated such a thing a week ago and had already started grabbing this and that here and there to build up our supplies of food adn other things) and acquiring acrylic colors and other needed materials .

SNIP

I grabbed one and three or four other things and then booked it back home before the sun had completely set. I was glad, too, because I had begun to get the distinct impression at three separate times that I was being followed. I'm always leery of such in disaster  situations. Most of the people in our part of Houston are upright, good people, but there are a few who whose veneer of civilization is liable to peel off with only the slightest provocation, so...

In any case, I managed to fade all of the people trying to follow me, and made it home without other incident. Mom was overjoyed about not having to resort to using newspapers and Haband catalogs for toweling, and I got my easel roll back. Now, to find a pic of a fluyt...

Glad you managed to shake off the zombies  Roll Eyes  Grin One question though... Has your area been placed in lock down already?
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Deimos
Snr. Officer
****
United States United States


aka Countess Millicent Addlewood


« Reply #35 on: March 14, 2020, 05:06:06 pm »

SNIP

And that's only half the photos I took. The whole shop was like this. The did leave 1/2 of the vinegar section untouched though. I took my precious 3 yellow onions and 3 cans of spinach home last night , with about 22 hamburger beef patties, and it turns out that another supermarket (same chain) near where I work in the ghetto part of the city was also very busy, but they still have most of everything. Now I have to decide whether to return the hamburgers and buy what I wanted or just stick to the hamburgers ($20 is still $20, you know). I guess poor people are being more sensible or they are better at restocking the supermarket, because the "educated" crowd are going bezerk.

Oooooo...bizarre...same thing happened to me.  I went out at 6AM to what I call the "barrio store" of this chain, because it actually is near the barrio ,and also only a half mile from me.
All the stores stock their shelves based on demographics, so this store doesn't have a lot of the more expensive items that other stores (of the same chain) stock. But I normally shop there because not only is it close, but because milk is milk, and apples are apples and the price of jalapeños is too good to pass up.
Once in a while I'll hit the "high end" store 5 miles away.

So  I get there and the store is almost empty (of people), and yeah the paper goods and hand cleaner shelves are also empty, but only a few of the "staples" shelves are empty...meat section is 2/3 full, frozen foods are 2/3 full.
I get my milk and a chocolate bar and five 8 oz blocks of cheese (on special at $1 each) cheddar and mozz and swiss, walk right up to open self checkout station. In and out in less than 15 minutes.

However (comma) I also wanted a sourdough baguette which that store doesn't carry (sourdough is "high end" food), so I head over to the high end store 5 miles away (same chain).
Lot is jam packed. I pick up two avocados in produce and head to the bakery section for the baguette. I notice all these people with carts (trolleys) snaking all over the store, and ask one of them what they are in line for. She answers "for checkout".

Oh.My.God. On closer inspection  I discovered there was only ONE cashier working and only 3 out of 12 self check-out stations were open.  (I guess the other cashiers were working remotely  *roll eyes*) There were at least 100 people waiting in line.
So I put the avocados back, didn't even bother getting the sourdough and left,  but not before checking the shelf stock.
That store didn't have near the amount of staple food stuffs that the barrio store had.  
(There are advantages to living in a blue collar part of town.)  
« Last Edit: March 15, 2020, 02:54:38 am by Deimos » Logged
J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2020, 08:01:17 pm »

To be fair the ghetto store has much larger crowds on a regular basis. I know because I'm there twice a day before and after work. My guess is they're used to processing a much larger volume, so keeping stocked is easier for them.
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Banfili
Zeppelin Admiral
******
Australia Australia



« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2020, 10:08:31 pm »

I'm not one to use extreme profanity, but omg, those pics are effin' scary!

I plan to hit the grocery store(s) later today.... and I have no idea what I'll see (or not see).
I'll let you all know....

Stash update: I actually have several months worth of food: frozen stuff (meat , veggies, pizzas, even ice cream) and  canned/jar stuff...beans, applesauce, fruit, peanut butter, jam, tomatoes, black olives (I love black olives), dry cereal, oatmeal.
Will have to get milk sometime this week, and bread, but I have still have  a dozen+ eggs.
I even have 3 or 4 boxes of biscotti  and a couple  packages of Oreos, and enough tea bags to last 3 months.

Try and get yourself some tinned/packaged dried milk powder - lasts longer in storage than regular milk, or UHT milk, which will store for 5-6 months.

Even in 'normal' times I keep a tin of Sunshine Milk Powder in the cupboard - for those times between pension payments when I run out of wet milk!

Every Aussie knows about Sunshine!
I'd really like some malt extract, or malted milk powder, too - my over the road IGA doesn't normally stock it, but I'm not that desperate that I'll make a special trip to 'big' town, or closest city, to get it!!
« Last Edit: March 14, 2020, 10:17:13 pm by Banfili » Logged
Synistor 303
Snr. Officer
****
Australia Australia


Zenyna Ironbracker


« Reply #38 on: March 15, 2020, 12:20:44 am »

Our local IGA (Independent Grocers Alliance) is pretty well stocked - got everything we needed there food-wise. I guess the locals here are not going bonkers, but the huge supermarkets in the huge shopping centre are being stripped a bit more. Got a big slab of mince (hamburger?) from Costco to make more taco mix and spag-bol. I make it every year at this time when our tomatoes are ripening. Also minestrone and tomato based curries. Fresh food is well stocked in the local shop here - the same as usual - but we have a huge veggie garden, so wont need to go out to get fresh stuff.

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« Reply #39 on: March 15, 2020, 01:33:16 am »

I'm not one to use extreme profanity, but omg, those pics are effin' scary!

I plan to hit the grocery store(s) later today.... and I have no idea what I'll see (or not see).
I'll let you all know....

Stash update: I actually have several months worth of food: frozen stuff (meat , veggies, pizzas, even ice cream) and  canned/jar stuff...beans, applesauce, fruit, peanut butter, jam, tomatoes, black olives (I love black olives), dry cereal, oatmeal.
Will have to get milk sometime this week, and bread, but I have still have  a dozen+ eggs.
I even have 3 or 4 boxes of biscotti  and a couple  packages of Oreos, and enough tea bags to last 3 months.


Try and get yourself some tinned/packaged dried milk powder - lasts longer in storage than regular milk, or UHT milk, which will store for 5-6 months.

Even in 'normal' times I keep a tin of Sunshine Milk Powder in the cupboard - for those times between pension payments when I run out of wet milk!

Every Aussie knows about Sunshine!
I'd really like some malt extract, or malted milk powder, too - my over the road IGA doesn't normally stock it, but I'm not that desperate that I'll make a special trip to 'big' town, or closest city, to get it!!


Today I looked at the "ghetto" store in the early afternoon. Not quite as bad as the fancy area supermarket, but they're catching up, just a few days behind. Most of the fresh meat was gone by 3pm on Saturday after work. The dry goods and toilet /kitchen paper rolls were missing since Thursday. Because that's an ethnically Mexican area, all the Masa for Tortillas and Tamales was gone too, but some people on the bus claimed the smaller ethnic markets still had plenty of food.


Our shop where I work was practically deserted today, I can only imagine everyone was at the supermarket or chasing food around town. Only a couple of customers walked into our shop. One customer claimed he was experiencing "symptoms" and wanted me to tell him what to do!! Needless to say I scrubbed the counters and my arms real well after he left with bleach (Tilex surface cleaner) before the next customer arrived  Shocked

The Opening Scene in 12 Monkeys (1995)



Today I got another 4 pounds of breaded chicken patties, to bump my rations to 42 days. I have not even thought about water /milk /snacks, which I thought were not so important.

I don't know if I can get powdered milk in those shops and if they did carry it, it's probably gone by now. At the moment, the best bet are thrift supermarkets (Dollar Tree, Dollar Store, etc.) I have not checked Walmart, but the one close by is very bad at restocking, so I'm not getting my hopes up.

Our local IGA (Independent Grocers Alliance) is pretty well stocked - got everything we needed there food-wise. I guess the locals here are not going bonkers, but the huge supermarkets in the huge shopping centre are being stripped a bit more. Got a big slab of mince (hamburger?) from Costco to make more taco mix and spag-bol. I make it every year at this time when our tomatoes are ripening. Also minestrone and tomato based curries. Fresh food is well stocked in the local shop here - the same as usual - but we have a huge veggie garden, so wont need to go out to get fresh stuff.




Minced beef = ground beef, I think (?)

That's the other thing I probably need, tomato sauce would be nice with the breaded chicken patties (Chicken Schnitzel, or imitation Mexican Milanesa, an Italian cuisine adaptation to MX- there's so much Mexican food which people are not even aware of!) Probably paired up with mashed potatoes.. Forget about finding sausage. The ghetto store still had some sausage, but most was gone.

And to think that barely one week ago we were still thinking of going ahead with SXSW, haha! What a joke.

What a horrible spectacle it would have been to have an emergency with a few hundred thousand extra visitors from all over the world in town! I can't even imagine the pandemonium a few hundred cases would have generated within the festival week and the incredible show that would have been for all the world to see. The end of Austin as a tech and entertainment destination, as far as I'm concerned, never mind SXSW. I can see it now, famous musicians, gamers and indie film actors pleading via Skype and Twitter from inside the quarantine zone! Keynote speakers like Elon Musk being airlifted from the top of the Hilton downtown!

UPDATE : Supermarket chains around the country are starting to reduce hours in order to be able to restock and clean the shops. The chain i talked about (HEB in Texas, will reduce schedules to 8am - 8pm starting tonight. That'll make it very hard for me to shop in the evening after work, because shops will simply close before I arrive to the area where I live, and even the supermarket next to where I work may be inaccesible because I don't always close the shop on time. I'n other words, I can't shop in the evenings, and maybe not at all on a Saturday, and have to make a special second trip in the morning before work. Honestly, like this it makes it more difficult for me to reduce my exposure to the public by a factor of two (several more hours in public transportation). Isolation and social distancing? Ha!
« Last Edit: March 15, 2020, 02:10:04 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
rovingjack
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« Reply #40 on: March 15, 2020, 03:03:50 am »

I work at dollar tree in my area. we still have some foods, bleach, napkins, and soap. Because nobody thinks about the dollar tree when they think about grocery shopping (except the special needs, elder folks home, and ethnic minority groups for some reason). But even we have been out of the big ones for a while. Other stores in town... bread, and canned goods are disappearing.

I'm not really surprised by the lack of logic to a lot of it.

I bought a refillable spray bottle, some bleach, I have a supply of washable cotton rags, I chop up and freeze a fair number of veggies. I don't use toilet paper for anything other than the toilet and thus the four rolls I have should last the better part of six weeks. I have canned and dried beans, and dried rice.

I know how to live on a meal a day if I have to, I used to make my own soap.

Some folks have never struggled in life and it shows.

it will be interesting to see both how the next few weeks go, and in a few years how we all look back on this.
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Deimos
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« Reply #41 on: March 15, 2020, 03:06:18 am »

Can't see why milk/dairy supplies would be interrupted....Farms aren't affected per se unless all the workers come down with the virus.
But cows have to be milked regardless. And I'm guessing all dairy farms in developed countries use automation for milking/processing /storing.
You can freeze milk  (I have friends with a lot of kids that freeze milk) but if you freeze milk you've got no room to freeze other stuff. And previously frozen milk doesn't taste the same.
So I think you are right to say the powdered/instant stuff is probably in short supply, but I don't think regular "fresh" milk is hard to find.
ONe thing I forgot to mention is that I have citrus (grapefruit) coming out my ears.
 I have two grapefruit trees (one red and one white) that still are loaded with fruit. So I sure as heck won't be getting scurvy!    
  
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rovingjack
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« Reply #42 on: March 15, 2020, 03:28:25 am »

I forgot to mention why I mentioned I work at dollar Tree.

We get a delivery truck once a week, it's stockked with damn near a random supply of things that are preplanned frequent high consumption things.

I tend the candy section. Two candies were very popular: Goobers, and Snow Caps. We've been out of both since late January. I cannot order more. The system has to correlate the sales record with our in store supply record, and place an order, and then it has to wait for the suppliers to select the items for delivery, and ship it and two weeks after that we will likely get a weeks supply.

soooo, if half the stores out there are usuing even half of the same systems we are. I'd bet a minimum of 3 weeks before a small inadequate supply of various things arrives, and if people are as desperate as they have been frantic now, I'd wager we will see a couple months of rationed and short availability pulses.
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Banfili
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« Reply #43 on: March 15, 2020, 01:10:17 pm »

Our local IGA (Independent Grocers Alliance) is pretty well stocked - got everything we needed there food-wise. I guess the locals here are not going bonkers, but the huge supermarkets in the huge shopping centre are being stripped a bit more. Got a big slab of mince (hamburger?) from Costco to make more taco mix and spag-bol. I make it every year at this time when our tomatoes are ripening. Also minestrone and tomato based curries. Fresh food is well stocked in the local shop here - the same as usual - but we have a huge veggie garden, so wont need to go out to get fresh stuff.

People up here are pretty calm too - cities & bigger places seem to be having the most trouble. mince & chicken rissoles are on my shopping list for tomorrow, everything else is fine. Might stash a few in the freezer!
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MWBailey
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« Reply #44 on: March 15, 2020, 02:11:11 pm »

Quote


Glad you managed to shake off the zombies  Roll Eyes  Grin One question though... Has your area been placed in lock down already?






Oops... used the term loosely. Folks and relatives are/were calling it that in kind of a jokingly colloquial way, and it rubbed off on me.  No, we were not and are not in lockdown mode, unless our Mr. Abbott or somebody even more local has done something overnight that  I'm not aware of (hopefully a doubtful scenario).

I hope that doesn't happen; I can handle the idea of being expected to stick close to home and avoid close contact with other humans, loner soul that I am, but being effectively confined to the Great Indoors would be one of my conceptions of hell on Earth. I suppose, though, as long as I have either my fiddle or banjo or flute or all of the above, it might not be too hellish, save perhaps for those who would have to hear me, lol...
« Last Edit: March 15, 2020, 02:17:28 pm by MWBailey » Logged
rovingjack
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« Reply #45 on: March 15, 2020, 09:58:21 pm »

all the schools in the state are closing... cool, what are all the working parents supposed to do?
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Sir Henry
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« Reply #46 on: March 15, 2020, 11:10:41 pm »

all the schools in the state are closing... cool, what are all the working parents supposed to do?
Self-isolate?

I, on the other hand, am going to self-idolate. I have made a model of myself and will pray to it daily for health and continued immortality.
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rovingjack
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« Reply #47 on: March 15, 2020, 11:44:53 pm »

Self-isolate?

Not if they don't want to get evicted for being unable to pay rent, or have their utilities turned off, or suffer malnutrition from being unable to buy food.

They want things like rent money or nessecities, they show up for their shift. Paid sick time, or family leave is a pipe dream for most over here.
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Synistor 303
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« Reply #48 on: March 16, 2020, 12:24:49 am »

all the schools in the state are closing... cool, what are all the working parents supposed to do?
Self-isolate?

I, on the other hand, am going to self-idolate. I have made a model of myself and will pray to it daily for health and continued immortality.

Thanks for the laugh, Sir Henry!
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Mercury Wells
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« Reply #49 on: March 16, 2020, 02:13:46 am »

Trump 'offers large sums' for exclusive access to coronavirus vaccine

Sorry, if it is too poltical.  Embarrassed
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