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Author Topic: The Brassgoggles Model Making Club (the second non-SP model making thread).  (Read 28752 times)
von Corax
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« Reply #500 on: March 21, 2021, 11:45:05 pm »

Well, my masochism continues...specifically soldering

...I recently acquired a brass kit for a GNR/LNER A3 (which I intend to finish in BR livery as 60048 Doncaster, named not for the Town of the same name, but in the GNR's tradition of naming its' express locos after racehorses/Derby Winners).

Now, this is my first attempt at a brass kit and I'll admit I'm finding it easier than I thought (although its' proving difficult, and highlighting my need for some various bits such as a decent temperature controlled soldering iron and some clamps), but I've yet to injure myself and or damage the kit in anyway shape/form and after one day of work it's getting there, even with the difficulties I'm finding with getting the solder to flow, and the larger parts acting as a heat sink.

That said, I stand by my previous comments about soldering, it was definitely dreamed up by some kind of freak with three hands and asbestos fingers.
I believe Sr Marconi called soldering an art. He used a blowtorch and a five-pound bar of lead.
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Madasasteamfish
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« Reply #501 on: March 23, 2021, 05:27:01 pm »

*Warning Pic heavy post*
Well, it seems I have been quite busy over the past few days.

My Webb coal tank has received its' numbers:


My K3 has also had its' cabside numbers and tender lettering as well as it's boiler band lining (I decided to apply it using my more tried and tested method of a hairy stick rather than the bow pen, but I'm tempted to abandon it in future), although it still needs the loco number adding to the front buffer beam.


I know a rivet counter might complain I've used the plain Gill Sands typeface rather than the shaded type, but given the lack of reference pictures and my own limited research (the picture on the box, although black and white seems to show it in Apple Green which I understand the LNER used for its' passenger locos, rather than mixed traffic engines like the K3).

And, I've finished the basic assembly of my A3 kit


It still needs a few bits and pieces adding (such as the safety valve bonnet and tender axle boxes which are white metal castings) but given my attempts to attach them haven't worked too well I'm going to leave them for the moment. I know it's a rough and ugly piece, but given its' my first attempt at a brass kit I'm reasonably happy with it (I'd say it's at least as good, if not better than the 4MT tank I built about 4.5 years ago which was my first white metal kit).

In future I think I'll be much happier to build brass kits (rather than viewing them with my hitherto wariness), but I think would rather stick to them for carriages/wagons rather than locos, where the quality of detail offered by castings is better than etches.

Also, I've acquired the first piece of rolling stock for Dukeswood; a pair of Hornby LNER teak coaches.
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« Reply #502 on: March 24, 2021, 08:36:52 am »

Well done- you've got further with brass than I've managed. Your K3 looks right too, Gill Sans was originally made for the LNER- I think the plain yellow lettering came in in the 1940s (previously it was yellow shaded red).
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Persons intending to travel by open carriage should select a seat with their backs to the engine, by which means they will avoid the ashes emitted therefrom, that in travelling generally, but particularly through the tunnels, prove a great annoyance; the carriage farthest from the engine will in consequence be found the most desirable.
Madasasteamfish
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09madasafish
« Reply #503 on: March 24, 2021, 11:00:20 am »

Well done- you've got further with brass than I've managed. Your K3 looks right too, Gill Sans was originally made for the LNER- I think the plain yellow lettering came in in the 1940s (previously it was yellow shaded red).

Thank you very much.

And, if I've read the instructions on the HMRS transfers correctly, I seem to remember that the plain yellow lettering came in post war, but the shaded font was far more prevelant.
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The Bullet
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« Reply #504 on: March 27, 2021, 10:57:03 am »

I like the Webb tank.

Yesterday evening the class 55 came back into the workshop for some finetuning of the valve timing.
Everything went fine on the left cylinder.
When I wanted to take the valve cap off the right cylinder a screw broke.
This was a tiny screw with a slotted (!) hex head.
The head broke in half.
After reciting the necessary curses I managed to get it out using a pair of pliers.
Fortunately the "box-o-bits" had a suitable replacement.
Proper procedure while putting it in was adhered to by dropping in on the concrete floor twice, cursing and finding it.
The problem is:
The loco is a German Reichsbahn class 55 but as it was built by the late M J Price in Wales nothing is metric.

Hex head (slotted)
Head diameter 3.2 mm
Screw length incl head 8 mm
Tread outer diameter 2.2 mm

Can anyone guess what that could be?
BA? Model engineer? Something else?

As I now have no spares left I need to find out the type and order some.
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James Harrison
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« Reply #505 on: March 27, 2021, 11:14:31 am »

The 2.2mm OA diameter matches up with an 8BA screw.
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The Bullet
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« Reply #506 on: March 30, 2021, 05:03:48 pm »

The 2.2mm OA diameter matches up with an 8BA screw.

Where should I order?

Finally my 5" gauge Loriot has a suitable load:




This thing even has a winch and a three-speed gearbox.
Unfortunately it is not in working order as the return-flue boiler is in need of repair.
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Banfili
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« Reply #507 on: March 31, 2021, 04:06:23 am »

Many years ago I had quite a collection of model, mostly sailing, ships, in various sizes. I can't, at the moment go sailing. It was suggested to me that I make a model. The suggestion resonated!
I think I will try and hunt up a model kit and make a ship!  Grin

On reflection, I think I will hunt up a Tiger Moth aeroplane model instead - my dad used to fly one as a crop duster in the 1950s. I will paint it in his 'colours'!
« Last Edit: April 03, 2021, 12:11:24 am by Banfili » Logged
James Harrison
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« Reply #508 on: April 02, 2021, 08:33:56 am »

The 2.2mm OA diameter matches up with an 8BA screw.

Where should I order?


https://www.eileensemporium.com/materials-for-modellers/product/steel-countersunk-machine-screw-8ba/category_pathway-1343

I've used this supplier previously for other bits and pieces and they provide a good service.  I struggled to find an exact match via Google but reasoned that the critical critera are diameter over thread (2.2mm) and overall length (8mm).  I would advise double checking before ordering that 2.2mm O/A diameter really is 8BA, and that 8mm is equal to 5/16".
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James Harrison
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« Reply #509 on: April 03, 2021, 07:47:49 pm »

Resources are exhausted for the house, for the present, which means that therefore I have the time for the trainset.  Unfortunately, as I say, resources are exhausted for the house, which by extension means they're exhausted for the trainset.  I can pay for the beautification and upkeep of a roof over my head, or I can pay for my toys.  Some months the budget might stretch to both, more usually it's one or the other, and occasionally it's neither. 

That doesn't mean that everything has ground to a halt, I'm just somewhat limited at the moment for what can be achieved.  But that's not stopping me looking ahead to the days when I can throw my resources full-tilt at my pastime of choice.  To which end, I've recently been reading and thinking....


It's struck me somewhat that I might have been looking at my proposed layout all wrong.  Consider my list of wants; a decent-sized station, an interesting goods yard, a loco shed and a bit of open mainline; consider the room- 12' x 8', realistically reduced to about 9' x 7' when you allow for the door and the chimney breast, and then further consider that I don't want a roundy-roundy that eats the entire space- and consider how if I rearrange the furniture I can get a 9' unimpeded length of wall...

Realistically I've got an L shape 9' x 8' to play with, allowing for the depth of the inglenook, I can get all the scene track I want in that space but the payoff is no scenery, and also no fiddle yard... something's got to give somewhere.

One thing I can pare down is my train lengths, the more I've considered Red Lion Square the more I'm thinking of it as being the hub of a network of branch or secondary lines, rather than being on the main trunk.  Sufficient services to merit a multi-platform station with a bit of architectural nous, but only a few of them going further afield than Sheffield/ Nottingham/ Lincoln/ Chesterfield.  So less in the way of massive locos on long trains of big carriages, and more modest engines on short sets of smaller, older rolling stock. 

I've recently been finding a lot of my time on Youtube is spent watching American trackplanning videos, and it's struck me how more spatially-aware some of their designs are.  In Britain modellers seem to overlook that a room is measured in the X, Y and Z axis, and my railway room has a lot of the Z dimension.  A surfeit of it, you might say.

So what is there to stop me looking at a layout with two decks, joined by a helix sitting at least partially in that inglenook?  I could have a point to point layout, one deck could have the interesting goods yard and the other the loco depot, operationally I could work one deck on my own and use the other as staging, or I could have people over and run it like a real railway with trains actually going somewhere. 

I could have one deck where I concentrate on the track layout with perhaps almost minimal scenery beyond the boundary fence, the other I could have a more minimalist design but really go to town- if you'll pardon the pun- scenically, I'd get a mainline that is something a bit more than your typical fisherman's walk, which can only be good for the locos (even if a lot of that run is uphill on a curve), it seems a bit of a rare win-win-win-win.

I wonder if with a bit of thought it might even be possible to work a junction into it and put a third deck in, maybe freight-only to a colliery or something.

On the face of it this might give me two or even three 9' x 5' L layouts on the footprint of one, and suddenly I'm looking at this thinking I might be able to squeeze the proverbial quart into a pint pot, even perhaps working Cremorne for Pittance into the scheme.
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The Bullet
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« Reply #510 on: April 03, 2021, 08:29:45 pm »

Good idea:
Tunnel entrance, helix down (mind the big radius) and a complete level serving as hidden sidings.
Don`t forget you need at least two access ways:
- Loaded train goes north, comes back from the same tunnel empty, goes south, comes back from that tunnel loaded.
- The merry-go-round goods train that goes north and comes from the south the next day to go north again.

Had a running session today.
Weather was fine and class 55 was in steam for over six hours. Lots of ash in the smokebox afterwards but all flues were clear as she threw everything else in the air (and on my head).
Seems that I have set the valve gear correctly. She runs well, has lots of power and the steam consumption is less than before.
Must have had too much blower once as there was quite a bit of clinker on the grate.

Class 216 also did many laps. The new motors work well. She is down to prototype speed and has a lot more power than with the old motors and the chain drive.
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The Bullet
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« Reply #511 on: April 04, 2021, 11:03:45 am »

A few pics from yesterday:

Looking into the smokebox after more than 6 hours in steam.
A bit of ash but the flues are clear.


This is what came out of the smokebox.


Grate and the biggest bits of clinker.


I will make a grate with bigger gaps. That helped on other locos so might also work here.
The coal is anthracite.
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James Harrison
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« Reply #512 on: April 05, 2021, 07:59:55 pm »

I'd imagine those lumps of clinker would choke the fire after a while?- assuming the fire draws air over the ashpan?

Further thoughts and design progress on Rufford.  Helixes are out, as I'd need at least 4' x 4' to get them in and it's doubtful the locos could haul anything worthwhile up them.  So I'm suggesting like a train elevator instead, about 4' long (enough for a 4-6-0 and 3 corridor carriages, or that same 4-6-0 and 4 compartment carriages).  Two decks will be about 9' x 4' (leaving the end 4' open for access to the lift).  Two decks will be 9' x 8' (with the scenic area brought in front of the list). 

And into that area?  I've got two not-quite-mainline stations.  I've got carriage sidings.  I've got a locomotive depot.  I've got a goods yard that's probably better described as two yards linked with a goods-only branch.  I've got a country branch terminus.  I've got a waterworks.  Obviously I'll only be able to operate a fraction of it on my own, and the rest would basically be scenified storage, but it means when I invite people over to play we'll be able to actually run the whole thing like a proper railway, trains will actually go somewhere.... the only thing missing of course is the miles of unencumbered running line but frankly I've always found that sort of thing boring.  If I want to sit down and watch trains go past I can do that from the bay window in my sitting room...
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Mercury Wells
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« Reply #513 on: April 05, 2021, 09:48:06 pm »

James, do you have a cellar, that you could use for the layout?
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« Reply #514 on: April 05, 2021, 10:01:07 pm »

I don't have a cellar. I have an attic, which getting into is to rake your life into your hands, a 12' x 8' spare room of which 9' x 7' is useable, or a 60' garden to lose a shed in somewhere. Of those I think the spare room has the best potential.

(Edited to make legible, I 'ate you autocorrect...)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2021, 08:52:18 am by James Harrison » Logged
von Corax
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Prof. Darwin Prætorius von Corax


« Reply #515 on: April 06, 2021, 01:26:56 am »

You own, don't you? There'd be no landlord to object to tunnels running from one room to the next...? Wink
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James Harrison
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« Reply #516 on: April 06, 2021, 08:53:23 am »

You own, don't you? There'd be no landlord to object to tunnels running from one room to the next...? Wink

If I did that there'd be no stopping it  Cheesy  I need to draw the line somewhere unless I want to earn the title of Town Nutcase. 
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James Harrison
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« Reply #517 on: April 08, 2021, 04:38:29 pm »

Well, here is the plan as it stands.... in no particular order...



Rufford Red Lion Square deck.  There's no freight provision here at all, except for parcels that can be unloaded straight onto the platforms.  But what it does have are a few carriage sidings instead. 



The trains have to go somewhere, and as I've decided to look into scenic storage sidings that means really another station.  This takes its design hints from Chesterfield Market Place, which is 1. in the right part of the country for my network and 2. actually was part of the Great Central Railway between 1907 and 1922.  Unfortunately it was one of those stations where the goods yard inconsiderately spread itself over a large area, so I've cut that right down to the bare minimum.  This deck, unlike the others, I've split into two separate scenes, so in front of the train lift I have quite a respectable loco depot. 



This board I've drawn specifically to make use of the country station diorama I built a few years ago, then I've sketched in a goods line running into what I'm thinking of as a waterworks. 



And finally- that's the sort of goods yard I've had in mind since starting to plan years ago. 

I don't know about a quart, this feels like a demonstration of how you get a gallon into a pint pot. 
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Sorontar
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« Reply #518 on: April 09, 2021, 01:46:45 am »

Declaration: I don't do railway modelling.
James (and anyone else with similar designs), I am having trouble understanding why you wouldn't want to have a loop (if possible) in any model railway system so you can have one or more trains running around the tracks. I would have thought that watching that (and occasionally redirecting the trains onto new tracks) is more fun than having to continually (manually) turn everything around at each end (though I understand that that could be fun to do occasionally).
Have I misunderstood the purpose of your designs?

Sorontar
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« Reply #519 on: April 09, 2021, 02:12:04 am »

Declaration: I don't do railway modelling.
James (and anyone else with similar designs), I am having trouble understanding why you wouldn't want to have a loop (if possible) in any model railway system so you can have one or more trains running around the tracks. I would have thought that watching that (and occasionally redirecting the trains onto new tracks) is more fun than having to continually (manually) turn everything around at each end (though I understand that that could be fun to do occasionally).
Have I misunderstood the purpose of your designs?

Sorontar

Good question... I was wondering the same thing.
Also, you have 4 boards, correct? How big is each board?
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von Corax
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« Reply #520 on: April 09, 2021, 04:01:26 am »

Declaration: I don't do railway modelling.
James (and anyone else with similar designs), I am having trouble understanding why you wouldn't want to have a loop (if possible) in any model railway system so you can have one or more trains running around the tracks. I would have thought that watching that (and occasionally redirecting the trains onto new tracks) is more fun than having to continually (manually) turn everything around at each end (though I understand that that could be fun to do occasionally).
Have I misunderstood the purpose of your designs?

Sorontar

Good question... I was wondering the same thing.
Also, you have 4 boards, correct? How big is each board?
For some the enjoyment is in realistically modelling the equipment; for them a loop layout is ideal for showing off their handiwork. For others the fun is in realistically modelling the operation of a railroad. For them, the realism of the track layout is as important as the realism of the equipment, and how many real railroads do you know of that run in a loop?
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James Harrison
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« Reply #521 on: April 09, 2021, 10:15:52 am »

Declaration: I don't do railway modelling.
James (and anyone else with similar designs), I am having trouble understanding why you wouldn't want to have a loop (if possible) in any model railway system so you can have one or more trains running around the tracks. I would have thought that watching that (and occasionally redirecting the trains onto new tracks) is more fun than having to continually (manually) turn everything around at each end (though I understand that that could be fun to do occasionally).
Have I misunderstood the purpose of your designs?

Sorontar

Good question... I was wondering the same thing.
Also, you have 4 boards, correct? How big is each board?

There are four levels, each level is an 'L' shape measuring 9' x 8', and the maximum depth of the board is 3' 3".

Declaration: I don't do railway modelling.
James (and anyone else with similar designs), I am having trouble understanding why you wouldn't want to have a loop (if possible) in any model railway system so you can have one or more trains running around the tracks. I would have thought that watching that (and occasionally redirecting the trains onto new tracks) is more fun than having to continually (manually) turn everything around at each end (though I understand that that could be fun to do occasionally).
Have I misunderstood the purpose of your designs?

Sorontar

It comes down to personal choice and what people enjoy, and space considerations.  There's nothing implicitly 'bad' in a continuous run, it's just to do it well you need a lot of room.  If you were to scale down the very tightest turn to be found on the full size railway, you'd need somewhere in the region of 20 feet to get a 180-degree turn.  By means of various dodges and tricks train set makers can achieve 15" radius curves, but then advise that their better models need at least 17" or 19" curves, and even then that looks fairly toy like (locomotives lurch into the corners, and the rolling stock ends up with big overhangs at the ends and in the middle).  Luckily if you build a continuous run around the edges of the room, so that you're always in the middle of it looking out, the worst effects are largely invisible. 
All of that I can live with, but the space for my layout has to contend with a chimney breast and a low window, plus the doorway to get into the room.  For a continuous run, that effectively reduces a 12' x 8' space to more like 9' x 7'- which is really too small for the sort of railway I want to model (or at least, model it in a fashion that would satisfy me). 
Then there's factors of what I want out of my layout- I want something interesting to build and operate, in the context of modelling a mainline railway.  That means a station (always thought more of a terminus rather than a through station, for some reason- termini are more interesting to operate), a goods yard (I've found I've increasingly been drawn to the sort of design which has tracks going off in all directions and you end up running it as some sort of 3D chess set) and a loco depot.  9'x 7' you might, reasonably, get one of those.  Two if you're canny with the design.  To get all three in means simplifying the whole lot down at which point a lot of the interest goes...
Long story short, continuous run would be brilliant for sitting back and watching trains go by, but that's not what I'm looking for. 
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Sorontar
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« Reply #522 on: April 09, 2021, 01:54:35 pm »

Quote
Long story short, continuous run would be brilliant for sitting back and watching trains go by, but that's not what I'm looking for. 

Fair enough, I just wanted to be sure so I didn't misinterpret your objectives with it, especially with so many layouts.

Sorontar
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The Bullet
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« Reply #523 on: April 09, 2021, 03:22:04 pm »

Declaration: I don't do railway modelling.
James (and anyone else with similar designs), I am having trouble understanding why you wouldn't want to have a loop (if possible) in any model railway system so you can have one or more trains running around the tracks. I would have thought that watching that (and occasionally redirecting the trains onto new tracks) is more fun than having to continually (manually) turn everything around at each end (though I understand that that could be fun to do occasionally).
Have I misunderstood the purpose of your designs?

Sorontar

Depende on the modeller.
Some like to switch on the layout and watch trains go by.
Others (like me) like to do everything manually.
Express train comes into the station, engine is detached and sent to the shed/turntable/coal stage, shunter comes along and brings/removes mail wagon/goods wagons,..., new engine leaved the shed, passes the coal stage, moves into the station,....
My layout has a system on the outer circle that can handle one train. It stops at a signal, waits for a certain amount of time, then the signal is set to green and the train takes a lap.
This creates a bit of background traffic/noise while I am shunting or doing other things. I have two walk-around controllers so I am always at the point of action.

In 5" gauge I get even more as I have to put coal in, feed water and do all the other things a driver/fireman does.

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Madasasteamfish
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09madasafish
« Reply #524 on: April 12, 2021, 07:53:11 pm »

Well, things have begun to move on my narrow gauge micro (and should hopefully continue now it's possible to actually leave the house). The latest part of which is a scammel scarab mechanical horse which will sit alongside the goods shed (once it's got its' roof on).



This is a Dapol/former airfix kitmaster kit, and is obviously awaiting paint and transfers. Although it's been quite an awkward build (as almost all of these kits are) its' been interesting to see the parts for both trailer variants included (most often it's a choice between one or the other) and both might be usable.
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