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Author Topic: I'm trying to find these brass rods  (Read 536 times)
rod-on
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« on: April 03, 2019, 07:43:23 am »

G'day

I've seen these brass rods on a couple of different jacobs ladders and would love to find them somewhere .... can anyone help me find them?

https://imgur.com/a/labLEzw
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Lord Pentecost
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« Reply #1 on: April 03, 2019, 08:27:01 pm »

To me they look like they have been salvaged from something, possibly an ornate picture frame.
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« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2019, 01:08:15 am »

To me they look like they have been salvaged from something, possibly an ornate picture frame.

Yeah. I don't see this being commercially available anywhere... I'm wondering if thsi is a composite of plain wire brazed with decorative pieces?
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Synistor 303
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« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2019, 01:08:40 am »

I have a few heavier ones which I got from old brass light fittings. Lots of brass light fittings have very fancy brass bits on them. Have a look on Gumtree - most of them are cheap as because they are not in fashion...
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von Corax
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« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2019, 01:38:40 pm »

I can't help with the ornamental bits, but the rods themselves are easy - go to your nearest farm supply and ask for uncoated brazing rod.
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« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2019, 10:07:09 pm »

You have Lowe's hardware in Australia, don't you? In America they carry some small hobbyist brass stock as well...
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RJBowman
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« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2019, 10:29:16 pm »



If they don't need to be conductive, you could probably make something similar from thick wire and styrene and spray paint it to a brass color.
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rod-on
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« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2019, 08:02:53 am »

Here it is again in a different build

https://imgur.com/a/o9AYIaF

I have brass rods, but I'm looking for the decorative bits ...
« Last Edit: April 05, 2019, 12:46:29 pm by rod-on » Logged
Rose Inverness
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« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2019, 08:23:11 pm »

Have you tried making them yourself out of wax and doing a lost-wax casting? Involves mold-making, etc, but that'd be a good way to get what you want out of it (over and over again if you make a reusable mold...).

If you're really not looking to fabricate them yourself I'd start by searching Etsy and the like using terms like 'filigree brass' or 'decorative brass' in the category of items used to make things (rather than the vintage or handmade categories).
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Deimos
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« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2019, 09:26:40 pm »

I also believe it is brass filigree that has  been brazed onto the rods.
Something like this: https://www.etsy.com/listing/106756125/10pcs-raw-brass-connector-earrings?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=raw+filigree+brass&ref=sr_gallery-3-35&organic_search_click=1  or this  https://www.etsy.com/listing/106756125/10pcs-raw-brass-connector-earrings?ga_order=most_relevant&ga_search_type=all&ga_view_type=gallery&ga_search_query=raw+filigree+brass&ref=sr_gallery-3-35&organic_search_click=1
You'd have to split it or cut off what you don't need, of course, but the stuff isn't very thick.
I've cut apart a lot of brass filigree "Jewellery findings" using a small pair of diagonal nippers.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2019, 09:30:00 pm by Deimos » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2019, 01:16:07 am »

Yeah, it's something custom made. Victorian/Edwardian Era devices would not be so fancy to have embellishments in the wires. Either that was custom made for novelty Jacob ladders (kits made in small numbers), or thepeople who made it just bought some filligree and brazed it to regular wire.



~ ~~
I would like to discourage gluing non-conductive pieces to the rods. There is no such thing as a non-conductive material. At high enough voltage potentials electrons will start flowing into materials we regard as non-conductive. Also note that electrical arcs generate very high localized temperatures. At 9000+ Volts of potential, air is turning into plasma / ionizing as a result of the arc and producing small amounts of ozone (which is toxic to breathe). The purpose of the wire having a small diameter is to concentrate the electric charge. Electric charge tends to concentrate on sharp pointy objects and thin wires.
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Rose Inverness
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« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2019, 10:20:50 pm »

Good find, Deimos!

Question for J. Wilhelm or anyone else who is more expert than I on Jacob's Ladders/electricity in general... If a person were creating a Jacob's Ladder with the intention for it to be purely decorative, does the proximity/shape/design of the wires carry any inherent risk of electrons arcing without attaching high voltage such as a transformer? My thought is no, but as I hinted earlier I had not even a passing familiarity with these contraptions before viewing this thread.

In pursuit of greater knowledge,
Rose Inverness
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von Corax
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« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2019, 11:22:22 pm »

Good find, Deimos!

Question for J. Wilhelm or anyone else who is more expert than I on Jacob's Ladders/electricity in general... If a person were creating a Jacob's Ladder with the intention for it to be purely decorative, does the proximity/shape/design of the wires carry any inherent risk of electrons arcing without attaching high voltage such as a transformer? My thought is no, but as I hinted earlier I had not even a passing familiarity with these contraptions before viewing this thread.

In pursuit of greater knowledge,
Rose Inverness
No. Without a high voltage potential between the electrodes, there will be no arc. According to The Source of All Truth and Knowledge, an arc will not form until the voltage potential across the gap reaches 3000 volts per millimetre of gap; this sort of voltage does not occur spontaneously in nature.

Hope that helps.
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Synistor 303
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« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2019, 02:07:40 am »

Again, I would suggest you try brass light fittings on Gumtree... Such as; https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/glenroy/ceiling-lights/vintage-brass-lighting-fixture/1214733195
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« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2019, 05:16:33 pm »

20 years ago, it was 1kV / mm...it depends on pressure and humidity...but IF you want this for a JL, it needs to be smooth.
The deco stuff up there is way too bumpy. The arc might get stuck on one of those "break out points", like on a tesla coil.
Add a wire to the donut on top, and it will arc out there and there only.
Thermodynamics might push it across smaller flaws, but I wont take that risk...matter of amps I assume. The hotter the arc,
the more easy-going ^^
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