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Author Topic: Windows 10?  (Read 5304 times)
Prof Marvel
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learn from history, or be doomed to repeat it


« Reply #25 on: July 30, 2015, 04:35:11 am »

Actually, I didn't hear what just happened with Android...

You mind elaborating, or providing a link to an article?


that would be this one "Your Android smartphones can be hacked by just a malformed text message."
http://6abc.com/technology/android-phone-hack-puts-950-million-users-at-risk/888522/
http://thehackernews.com/2015/07/android-phone-hacking.html

dang, and I only just had to dump my "mil-spec" rubber armored waterproof motorola dumb fliphone
and got an LG G3.

stoopid smartphone. took me 3 days to figure out how to answer it ...

yhs
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« Reply #26 on: July 30, 2015, 04:50:52 am »

Okay, wrong word. Line printer, is that right?

One of these!
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« Reply #27 on: July 30, 2015, 09:33:07 am »

Learned BASIC on a Linotype.    


Ah My Dear Maets -

On a Linotype!


that must have taken one hellacious interface design ...
I can just imagine the cast type being sent down a chute to be collated, then read by an early 1-D OCR  , and the characters tranaslated into ASCII over a serial line... unless the cast type was collated and a printed newsheet made, which could then be  read by a minion into a voice-interface.....

yhs
prof marvel


That is awesome  Grin  Or perhaps one could have used a loom machine in reverse?  Create the punch cards from the pattern in the loom?  Grin



Okay, wrong word. Line printer, is that right?

One of these!



Did I ever mention that back in the early nineties at my university, we had this really old super computer (naturally housed in a separate location - underground actually)?.  We used dumb terminals to run our programs (engineering), and we actually printed our home work on giant line printers, whose output was kept for us on long sheets (like the ones shown above), but they were "hung" from wire hangers in a separate building, the same way one picks suits from the dry cleaners?  Grin  I had to go down two flights of stairs, then cross the street just to pick my printout.  Thankfully that museum piece of a computer was retired just one year after I enrolled at that college.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2015, 09:35:47 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged

Prof Marvel
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« Reply #28 on: August 06, 2015, 12:50:34 am »

AAAAAaaaaaaannnnnnd here I am to say

"Told ya so. Saw it right off"

Now that the so-called free Win10 is out, reports are trickling in
(rememeber kids , TANSTAAFL )

win10 downsides:
1) Stability – Windows 10 has launched with a surprisingly large number of bugs. Among these are disappearing icons from the taskbar, Start Menu lock-ups, Windows Store download bugs, copy and paste errors,  problems with audio and more.

2) Mandatory Updates – Microsoft’s decision to force updates upon users also has significant downsides. This has included automatically installing a broken graphics driver which crashed displays, a security patch which crashed Windows Explorer and more.

3) Brutal Enforcement Policies - Microsoft requires users to accept these terms in its Windows 10 EULA (end user licence agreement) and security updates now sidestep Windows Update and are installed to all versions of Windows 10 without warning.

4) Privacy -If the enforcement policies were tough, however, they have nothing on the privacy violations  in the Windows 10 EULA. A notable section reads:

We will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary.”

Needless to say “necessary” is a crucial qualifier, but that all comes down to trust – and there’s not a great deal of that going.

5) Ease of Use -  Windows 10 is never going to be as intuitive to use as Win7.

6) Lost Features
  - Windows Media Center which is a mainstay in some home media setups,
  - no native DVD playback
  - no desktop gadgets
  - no floppy drive support.
  - no free games they have been removed and are avail from the Windows Store with payment required to remove ads

7) Broadband Hog –  the new OS uses a peer-to-peer (p2p) update distribution system called ‘Windows Update Delivery Optimization’ (WUDO). basically By default, Windows 10 turns your PC into a server for distributing updates to other machines.

ummm WTF?

Evil Microsnot wants to use MY machine like a TORRENT SERVER  !?!?!  The ramifications and legal liabilities on
ME are enormous. I WILL be held liable for any transmissions from my machine even if I have nothing to do with it. For example see those who allowed torrent servers who were targeted by Law Enforcement  for music distribution.

finally Microsnot has openly stated that ‘Windows as a service’ is the platform’s future,  it opens up the future of charging for add-ons. This can be as small as Solitaire and Windows DVD Player but can scale up to bigger features they can and will push to users through Windows 10’s mandatory upgrades. Suddenly a new feature appears on your machine that you have to pay to use - and good luck getting rid of it.

your in sadness
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SeVeNeVeS
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« Reply #29 on: August 29, 2015, 10:48:05 am »

So, my dear old Dad decided to go for the free upgrade and somehow installed it himself. Shocked

All well and good but when everything goes south, (as it does on a regular basis) guess who has to sort it out?, yup, me  Roll Eyes

I havn't a clue with 10, just about sussed 7 for him and he hated it.

I foresee alot of time in the future headscratching and pondering when he can't use it or get the printer to work etc. Its been on since the install because he could'nt find the shutdown  Tongue

All I can say at the moment is........... Bugger!
« Last Edit: August 29, 2015, 10:50:31 am by SeVeNeVeS » Logged

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« Reply #30 on: August 29, 2015, 02:22:39 pm »

This thread had gone quiet until SeVeNeVeS' post; so, anyone else have horror stories to share? Or success stories...?

(If I'm interpreting matters correctly, it seems most of the followers of this thread are very wary, so you may not have either. But, I'm curious.)
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« Reply #31 on: August 29, 2015, 05:53:17 pm »

Works fine for me. Found a lot of nice apps that replace programs I've been using for years, but look nice whilst doing it. I'm one of those shallow people who say with all our processing power we should be able to make this stuff look NICE, as well as functional.

Did take a bit to break it in, and remove all the crap, but working well here.
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« Reply #32 on: August 29, 2015, 06:09:31 pm »

(This will devolve into an extremely technical discussion that will quickly speed by my skull, but here goes...)

How does one remove the crap?

And does removing the crap resolve the issues pointed out by Prof. Marvel, specifically items 2, 3, 4, 6, and 7?

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« Reply #33 on: August 29, 2015, 07:03:37 pm »

Well the thing I've seen to sort out most of that is to add Microsofts servers to your host file, thereby cutting basically any communication off. Cuts ALL communication off though. Look on Github for Unfuck Windows 10 for a bunch of little utils to tidy it up, but be careful to read what each script does, and only run ones you understand HOW and WHY they work. Never run a shell command you don't understand.

https://github.com/dfkt/win10-unfuck
~Longeye~
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #34 on: August 30, 2015, 05:48:21 am »

To me, Windows has inched all the way to obsolescence.  I haven't used it in many years now (I stopped using it at Vista / 7).  It seems to me all I'd want it for is for a dual boot machine where I use Windows for those "legacy" applications I need (mostly archival at this point in time).  But to be honest there is very little that free software cannot do (as far as general office and multimedia and compatibility with Windows Office).  Since all my "important" software was Unix / Linux based to begin with, I have essentially lost almost nothing by abandoning Windows.  Now I'm pondering whether I would have ANY need for it, given the disadvantages as pointed out by Prof Marvel.  Sort of like having a "quarantined" application with a virus on your hard drive.

Not having native support for DVD players right out of the box in Win 10, makes the OS look a lot like mid 2000 Linux distros. And that was never an obstacle if you knew where to get the software (e.g. Xine) and/or codecs.

Can't I just run Cortana in a vitual Winodws in VMWare?  Or perhaps the folks of Wine will come up with a plugin to run Cortana.exe?  Grin

Cortana:  Where am I?  I can't see my body!
Me: I transplanted you to Ubuntu
Cortana: No!!!!
« Last Edit: August 30, 2015, 05:52:49 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
Angus A Fitziron
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« Reply #35 on: August 31, 2015, 09:17:34 pm »

I currently run 3 PCs, a Sony Vaio laptop, a family desktop that I built around an ASUS P7H55D-M PRO mobo and my audio workstation that I built on an ASUS H87 PRO mobo. Actually I still have an XP m/c that is waiting to be re-housed so that doesn't really count...
The Sony and family PC ran W7 home premium and the audio workstation runs W8.1, which by the way, I am very happy with. The Sony VAIO had a bit of a problem a while back so had a complete rebuild with a clean W7 build with none of the Sony bloatware with the result that a few things stopped working, the only one of which bothered me was the web cam. So, I decided to move to the W10 platform with the laptop (I reserve judgement on the description 'upgrade) and my experience is as follows:

The upgrade took a couple of attempts but eventually all went smoothly - I think W7 needed to complete a couple of updates first.
The web cam started working! Result
The DVD player stopped working.
The sound card stopped working.
Video playback stopped working.

I started searching the forums to find out what was going on - I checked drivers were up to date - I looked at horrifying suggestions of how to write scripts to fix the guts of my PC (as suggested by MS own help desks) only to discover the following day that the audio card was working fine, as was the video playback! I wonder if there is some curious linkage between trying to use a feature, only to be not able to, your PC generating an error message and MS sending the necessary patch overnight??

So, only the DVD player then - investigation showed that if you have Home Premium 7 then you can have Windows DVD Player for free - so where was mine?? I looked, I searched, I checked web pages, all to no avail. The next morning, my laptop had miraculously sprouted Windows DVD Player...

I like 8.1 so I guess that puts me out of step with many here. I like it better than 10 and in any case, Cubase do not recomend moving to 10 until they have done a lot more testing. I won't be changing the family PC to 10 either any day soon, not until I know much more. Top of the list is how do I restore access to my NAS? As mentioned above, the only result offered is this dodgy looking service which looks awfully like a P2P server.

At the moment, very much a Curate's Egg
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« Reply #36 on: September 01, 2015, 09:11:45 am »

Oh.  I see. Observing the system changes the nature of the operating system.  Probably based on Quantum Computing  Grin
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rovingjack
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« Reply #37 on: April 04, 2016, 04:33:46 am »

I keep getting the prompts and like any good sales ad they have me thinking they will add functionality. I keep feeling like I should update while I can...

Somebody elsewhere just told me though that my scanner/printer will essentially become a brick, which is a deal breaker. odds are good my dvd play will stop working and I'd lose some of the productivity software that I use for projects.

seems like I'd best just skip it, and have my only dealings with win 10 be if an when I buy a new computer with it preinstalled.
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #38 on: April 04, 2016, 04:46:28 am »

I keep getting the prompts and like any good sales ad they have me thinking they will add functionality. I keep feeling like I should update while I can...

Somebody elsewhere just told me though that my scanner/printer will essentially become a brick, which is a deal breaker. odds are good my dvd play will stop working and I'd lose some of the productivity software that I use for projects.

seems like I'd best just skip it, and have my only dealings with win 10 be if an when I buy a new computer with it preinstalled.

Can you do dual boot?  Don't throw away the old operating system.
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wolfmanyoda
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« Reply #39 on: April 05, 2016, 05:28:07 pm »

I keep getting the prompts and like any good sales ad they have me thinking they will add functionality. I keep feeling like I should update while I can...

Somebody elsewhere just told me though that my scanner/printer will essentially become a brick, which is a deal breaker. odds are good my dvd play will stop working and I'd lose some of the productivity software that I use for projects.

seems like I'd best just skip it, and have my only dealings with win 10 be if an when I buy a new computer with it preinstalled.

Is there something special about your scanner/printer that it won't work with windows 10? All of my hardware worked fine from day 1 with windows 10, including my printer/scanner.
Once I put a stop to all of the privacy issues that I could, I've had no problems.
I also did a clean install though, some people have had serious problems with a straight upgrade.

The dual boot option is a great idea. You could try that and see what works and what doesn't, if everything works then you could eventually switch over completely if you like it.
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« Reply #40 on: April 06, 2016, 11:08:30 pm »


Is there something special about your scanner/printer that it won't work with windows 10? All of my hardware worked fine from day 1 with windows 10, including my printer/scanner.
Once I put a stop to all of the privacy issues that I could, I've had no problems.
I also did a clean install though, some people have had serious problems with a straight upgrade.

The dual boot option is a great idea. You could try that and see what works and what doesn't, if everything works then you could eventually switch over completely if you like it.
Somebody in another group I belong to has a newer model of the same all in one, and said theirs was pretty much an anchor now because the drivers are a problem.

The thing is I don't actually need windows 10. I just don't want to pay for it if I end up getting it later and right now I could get a free upgrade. I might look into a dual boot but there is no real sense of urgency.


Can you do dual boot?  Don't throw away the old operating system.

I could but I'm a bit torn with the privacy issues, the no control updating, and using my system as described in the professors post. Between that and lost ability to function with some hardware and drivers, it seems a bit like storing fertalizer in the pantry. I'd likely not be using it and I don't need some turds taking up space and possibly making things unhealthy.

I suppose I will just have to have it be something I confront on the next new system I buy.
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« Reply #41 on: April 13, 2016, 09:40:26 pm »

W10 status update

Along with a fair number of other users, my laptop no longer has the much lauded start screen! Windows opens in much the same way as W7 and stays in desktop mode. If I click on the windows symbol in the LH end of the bottom tool bar, or if I press the windows key - nothing! Absolutely nothing. Cortana does not respond to a click nor does clicking on the task view symbol do anything except minimise the screen. The main problem is that although I am familiar with desktop, I spent a lot of time developing the start screen and many of my favourite programs usually open from there - but no more... Windows 7 and 8.1 machines are not going anywhere near 10 anytime soon!


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« Reply #42 on: April 15, 2016, 09:13:42 pm »

I was stunned when my PC began spontaneously "updating" to Win10 earlier this week, without me doing anything.  (I'd "reserved" a copy last year but never authorized an install, as everyone I asked said to wait until bugs were fixed, etc.)
I was able to abort the install before it got very far and then researched and found this has been happening all over with growing frequency.  MS somehow tweaking our settings to start installing Win10 without our specific authorization.
Beware!
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #43 on: April 15, 2016, 11:59:33 pm »

I was stunned when my PC began spontaneously "updating" to Win10 earlier this week, without me doing anything.  (I'd "reserved" a copy last year but never authorized an install, as everyone I asked said to wait until bugs were fixed, etc.)
I was able to abort the install before it got very far and then researched and found this has been happening all over with growing frequency.  MS somehow tweaking our settings to start installing Win10 without our specific authorization.
Beware!


Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated into the collective!   Grin
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« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2016, 08:10:26 pm »

I've been running Win10 since launch after upgrading from 8 to 8.1 and then 10.  I find that if you had Win8 / 8.1, and like me, you found it a little difficult to get on with (compared to my previous OS - Windows XP Home - I never had Win7), then you may still have difficulties with Win10, but they are a lot less than the issues with Win8 / 8.1.  I now even have a tablet PC that runs Win10 (Linx 8" tablet) - and although it's specifications are a bit rubbish compared to other modern tablets, it boots up and runs faster than any of my Android devices ... Plus, with a little trickery (not hard), I can install and run pretty much any PC program / game (have installed my graphic editing software on it, and using Steam a few older PC games which run silky-smooth with my Bluetooth keyboard and mouse).

Anyway, it's not all peachy! ... Yes Win10 does have quite a few bugs, and MS have gone the way of the consoles regarding hardware.  Basically the hardware is tied to the OS.  This means that if you change some of the hardware, it may work fine, but if you change the wrong bits, the whole system stops working.  I recently upgraded my motherboard, CPU and graphics card, and could not get windows 10 to boot.  It would load initially using the Win10 loading screen, and then proceed to say that there was an error "For more information, please look up the following fault code BOOT_DEVICE_UNAVAILABLE" (yet it WAS booting from it, AND producing the error messages from it!!!).

Long story short, I had to wipe my C: drive as I could not access it at all (luckily I put all my files on a separate hard drive & partition).  However wiping it was a pain, as when I tried (using the "restore tools" installed on a Win10 install DVD I'd made via my laptop), it said "cannot find a valid drive" (it couldn't see the C: drive at all !!!).  It took a LOT of f**king around over 3 days to get the damn thing to wipe my C: drive and then re-install.  Since then, it doesn't seem to work quite as it should (hard to explain).  Despite using the latest drivers (from the manufacturer's, not MS) that are for Win10 there are a few "niggles" here and there.  In general I can do anything I want with the PC now, I just have to put up with the odd error from a program or service on booting my PC, or when trying to run certain software.  Oh, I also had a problem with file permissions, meaning that I could try and save something / play a game (with an auto-save of some sort built in) and the system would crash / throw up an error - because my personal files folders (where the game stores it's data) is now set to "read only" - and no matter how many times you change the settings, they restore themselves.  Got round it in the end, but it involved a lot of messing around with security permissions!

So in summary - Windows 10, when working, runs much quicker and more efficiently than any of my previous windows OS's, and if it's not set up right, it'll be a little less efficient and a lot more annoying.  But anyway.  It has some major flaws, which MS are not showing any interest in working on (when you look at the MS support forums - numerous similar or identical problems, and no real support, and NO hot-fixes.)    If you have Win10 and see advice asking you to run a code in some form of command window, ignore it - it screwed my system twice, and even after reporting the failure to them, they ignored it, deleted my post and locked the topic!

I'm not happy with Win10, but I don't have the time to go back to 8.1 on my desktop, as it would mean setting everything up from scratch again (as I no longer have the restore files).  And as my laptop, netbook and Win10 tablet are all linked, I sence putting one of them back an OS will mess something up between them, which I really can't be ar*ed to deal with right now! Sad
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« Reply #45 on: April 22, 2016, 10:59:27 am »

I never thought I'd say it, but it looks like Linux setup is now easier than Windows  Grin
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« Reply #46 on: April 22, 2016, 06:01:28 pm »

Linux setup has been easier than windoze for several years.  Most users never suffer through installing a windoze system, and if their PC needs it they get a professional to do the job.
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« Reply #47 on: April 23, 2016, 11:33:00 pm »

After reading through this, myself, I must say that my experience with Windows 10 has been less than satisfactory, but not inherently awful. At this point, though, I just want all of my systems to be running some variant of Linux unless it is 100% absolutely necessary that they aren't. I think that's my personal opinion, though.
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« Reply #48 on: April 24, 2016, 02:05:15 am »

It's the law of diminishing returns.  The more bells and whistles you have,  the more complicated it gets and it starts putting people off.  Linux traditionally was very difficult to setup. But the tables have turned.  Now the only thing that keeps Linux from taking front stage is software and hardware compatibility.  Admittedly that still seems unsurmountable, given that the only financial source for Linux distributors is service for corporations, since private users take advantage of public licenses.

On the other hand,  nothing beats "free" with the advent of software installation feature in most distros.  People who never knew Linux found in the last decade that it's very similar to updating their apps in their smartphones.  Windows 8 was just  playing catch up to the Unix-like operating systems, such as Linux and it's distant cousins iOS , and Android
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 06:25:40 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
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« Reply #49 on: May 18, 2016, 01:42:31 am »

Turned my computer on tonight and it started updating to Windows 10.  Got 3% of the way and then the computer shut itself off.  When I turned it back on it Restored to an earlier version.

I had never given it the go ahead to update.  Fortunately it is now back at windows 7.
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