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Author Topic: Dragon Tamers - A room for those of us with anxiety / depression / etc  (Read 96347 times)
Miranda.T
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« Reply #1675 on: February 17, 2019, 10:41:43 pm »


The north. It's not yet sure if the uni will take me, but I'm hoping for Aberdeen. If not there then maybe Inverness.

I'm not only moving out of my mother's house, but also out of my country. Which is a very big leap. And I'm very scared of it. The other day i was trying to log into my email to write a translating company for translating my documents and I just sat there for 15 minutes unable to log in

It's natural to feel nervousness at such a change, but that is such a beautiful area of the world and the people are so friendly. Will you be able to Skype (or similar) your family? I remember when I was at university 'phone calls to home being a wonderful pick me up if I was feeling a bit down, and I would imagine being able to see as well as hear would really work wonders if one was feeling a little homesick. I do think you once you've had a chance to settle down you'll love it - just remember to take along plenty of warm clothes   Smiley.


Rovingjack, I FEEL YOUR PAIN MY DEAR!!!!!!! Aaaauuugghhhh. That is the STORY OF MY LIFE. I have started clubs, bands, thrown parties, you name it. And so many times sat alone, getting sadder and more withdrawn. And the thing where every little noise..... It's so unfair. Why does this world allow any of us to Ever feel that lost??? pm me if you ever want to. It might help us both to expand our circle.

(Snip)

It's a shame the teleporter has yet to be invented, as then all of us denizens of BrassGoggles could meet up in person. We used to put on a lot of parties, but as time went by we had fewer and fewer people making the effort to come along. I think as people get older they get a bit set in their ways and, to an extent, stop making an effort. It's a good job Steampunks have a more positive outlook! Anyway, I hope the members of your family feel better soon.

Yours,
Miranda.
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Rose Inverness
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« Reply #1676 on: February 18, 2019, 03:07:50 am »

(snip)

It's a shame the teleporter has yet to be invented, as then all of us denizens of BrassGoggles could meet up in person. We used to put on a lot of parties, but as time went by we had fewer and fewer people making the effort to come along. I think as people get older they get a bit set in their ways and, to an extent, stop making an effort. It's a good job Steampunks have a more positive outlook! Anyway, I hope the members of your family feel better soon.

Yours,
Miranda.


It's why we have this room, isn't it? With the dark wood paneling and myriad nooks of coziness. Though seeing people in person is really good for the soul.... I'd like to have some casual steampunk get-togethers that are free.... or... casual get-togethers with steampunks might be a more accurate phrasing.

And thank you for the well wishes.
Rose
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That delicate forest flower,   
With scented breath and look so like a smile,   
Seems, as it issues from the shapeless mould,   
An emanation of the indwelling Life,   
A visible token of the upholding Love,   
That are the soul of this great universe.

~William Cullen Bryant

Trains to Steamtown, this way...
rovingjack
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« Reply #1677 on: March 20, 2019, 07:44:16 am »

Shambles in feeling exhausted. trailing whisps of dream that corrupted the mood of my day.

I don't have nightmares. I just get opprobrious dreams.

I was enthusiastic about a convention where all my friends would be. It was some sort of illogical class reunion where friends who never went to school with me would be there too. All the adventures to discuss and share. I couldn't wait to talk with spouses and kids of people I care about, to discuss his interest in blacksmithing, or hers in bullet journaling. I found gifts for kids that were perfect for all their interests. Theater, hockey, etc etc. I spent the day before making sure I shaved and made special effort to not look like a disheveled mad scientist or a homeless man... both of which I technically am. and the reunion rolls around and I show up... and I'm the only one there. I pace around for 45 minutes thinking maybe somebody would come late. Nobody does.

I'm mostly just resigned to the fact that it happened. I pack up all the gifts, and have them delivered. And I get up and focus on moving on to something else.

months, maybe years later I run into one of my friends, who is also all of them at once. they are surprised when they seem me and are all small talky chattery. The show me pictures of all the children with their favorite belongings... the gifts I gave them. "She's had that forever, I don't even remember where we got it for her."

And some part of me seethes over and calmly asks questions about their families and jobs and passions and eventually stopping and very seriously asks. "How many kids do I have?" 'what?' "Am I married? What do I do for a living?" 'I don't understand?' "What city do I live in?" and as they stammer at the sudden tone change I get angry. I answer all those same questions about them, their spouse, and kids. "You know nothing about me, you recognize my like you recognize a town center you've passed through before. You couldn't picture it, don't know anything about it, and never think about it, but when it's before your eyes theres a sense you've seen it before."

And in that moment I want to be mad, but it dawns on my that this is like a kid with unrequited love. There is no malice or obligation here, the problem is them. It's me. I've thought all along that I had friends, and built in my mind a bond that nobody else felt. I'm just the last one to realize what everything truely is. I could disappear off the face of the earth and nobody would notice for months Until they needed something. I've been tending a garden that I thought was something we shared only to find out nobody but I visits it and even if they passed though it they wouldn't notice it as something somebody tended to.

and I woke up, looked at the ceiling and said "Well F Lips sealed you too brain."

Subsequent events of the day did nothing to help me for the most part. It was a counciling day, but theres a lot to unpack from all of this and complicating factors outside it that feed into it. But the important thing about it all is that this wasn't a dream. A dream illustrated it, but the underlying truth of it all is: I do show up to gatherings of friends to share things we work on and have and end up being the only one to show up. I could go missing and nobody would notice. and I can name the whole families and interests of every one of my 'friends', but none of them could answer any of those questions about me, and it's not because I haven't discussed them before. I have been tending gardens nobody visits.

and mostly I just feel mad at myself for not reading the room well enough to see that I was clinging to something that wasn't really even there. And I'm not sure I'd know how to do or be anything else than this.

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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1678 on: March 20, 2019, 04:09:37 pm »

Shambles in feeling exhausted. trailing whisps of dream that corrupted the mood of my day.
*snip*

That is a manifestation of your subconscious concerns. It means that your worries are now intense enough that you are explicitly dreaming about it.

I don't think there is a specific answer to those concerns. Just acceptance of the cold hard facts. Statistically, it's not your fault you're alone. Or that you're not wealthy, Or that you're not successful like your friends. Things happen in life, and not everybody is blessed with family/money/house and/or a close community around them. There are factors such as genetics (eg mental disorders), health/death, abuse, divorce, bankruptcy, dictatorship, war, what have you. And note most successful people had help from someone, like family, or in the worst case scenario actually cheated in some way, even exploiting someone to get there! It takes a village to raise a child, and it takes a city to make a millionaire. Just look at the college admissions scandal right now in the US!! All you have to do is look at the lives of people in countries that are experiencing trouble, so you can see how bad life can get for good decent people when the infrastructure is not there. Environment does matter.

Also, human beings are intensely tribalistic. They have multiple levels of regard for people around them. Stranger, boss, coworker, friend, close friend, lover, spouse, child. I don't know if it's an evolutionary trait, but I reject the notion that everything around a human being is 100% a social construct. Instead, I think that the circles of people around you are a hybrid of biologically required structures, and the so-called social-construct. There is biology and instinct to factor into human behaviour. I don't believe that "close friend" qualifies as the highest status that you can have in front of another person, precisely because of biological imperatives - no matter how thoughtful your gifts are. The problem is then that sporadically your friends just say "hi," and then they leave and go back to their homes (at least where you live- read on).

So, given that very bitter pill, the question is "What are you going to do about it?" I mean, this is not your fault. And people are not going to change. And to be honest, I can't really answer that question either, because I'm figuring the answer right now myself.

But, my approach to the problem has been to look at the hierarchy above and focus on my statement "environment does matter." The closest answer I can give you is that "If the environment I'm in is not suitable for my needs, then I change my environment." Notice I wrote that NOT ALL human behavior is a social construct. The corollary is that NOT ALL human behaviour is biological either. So that means that it is possible to move to another environment where the social hierarchy is more close to satisfying your psychological need.

Is that even possible?

Yes. Yes it is. Since you're travelling all around, and you still feel dissatisfied socially speaking, you might disagree with me. But my reply to that is that you have not travelled far enough (read on)... The reason I say that is because I actually was raised in a different country. I had a good family life. We had tons of friends. And I was raised in a highly structured environment which promoted my growth, development and happiness. For all the negative stuff on human nature I wrote above, I have the exact opposite experience of my childhood and the lives of my grandparents. I actually KNOW that things can be different.

So what is different about the environment in my childhood?

The level of socialization. Not all societies have the same level of socialization. After 30 years living in the US I realise that I'm missing something I knew every day of my life while I was living in Mexico... To my fellow Americans: please don't take offense, but there are other countries that have different social structures which I would say are far more developed than what I currently see in the 1st world. To put it bluntly, there are places in the world where a larger group of people around you can pay attention to you in a more structured and meaningful way. The 1st world is profoundly "nuclear" and people are very isolated from one another in comparison to the communities of many developing nations - I'm not sure if social isolation is a consequence of industrialization, but it seems to me to be that way.

Some of those structures in developing nations favour an "extended family," meaning multi-generational living arrangements, which lend themselves toward cooperation and a greater financial support for those who would be "weak" in some sort of way. Grandparents can become caretakers, and you even have "assistant parents" in the form of Godparents. Which is not just a funny title of an Italian Mafia movie - the Godmother and Godfather ACTUALLY play a role in the child's development, outside of religious ceremonies like baptism, and these Godparents, one pair per child, form longstanding relationships with the Godchild's family and since they are not related by blood, they link to the greater community (this is the outer reach of the extended family)

The structure outside of the family is equally developed into greater community networks. Social activities between school or workplace peers is practically mandatory for - I'd even venture to say, every single weekend of the calendar! It's not unusual for class meetings to take place every year, often organising trips of public events! Every single weekend there was some gathering of some sort at one of the student's family homes (we'd rotate homes). These networls often lead to job opportunities as well. In short, people tend to help each other more because a larger rigid structure is in place.

But what I'm trying to say in a very roundabout way is that there are higher levels of socialization possible - and that you may simply be in the wrong place. Short of having a family, you will never achieve that ultimate level of "life meaningfullness," but what I know is that in modern developed societies, your greater social meaning has been reduced to a cold index of productivity, whether that be earning a certain amount of money, having a certain kind of job, a house or saving money for retirement. There is no intrinsic value to your life in the greater society of a developed country. And beyond that, the only biological meaningfulness of your life is limited to the nuclear family, having a spouse and children, and nothing else! That's it! So no wonder you can feel left out!

If you could find a society where the community constantly engaged with you, and you were sought after for your friendship and knowledge, would that make your life feel more fulfilled?  I think so. And so I've decided to make a such move to a place where I can do that. It's that simple. And if I end up having a family, well that's icing on the cake. That social structure is geared toward promoting relationships, so I'm not closing the door on family either. But what I know is that I can't stay here - slowly dying, sick, alone, depressed, and hungry for love and attention (not to mention physically hungry). No social security check is going to make up for that
« Last Edit: March 20, 2019, 04:22:28 pm by J. Wilhelm » Logged

rovingjack
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« Reply #1679 on: March 25, 2019, 03:49:33 am »

While that may be the case for you, the meaning for me is something else. It's actually down to a something I've been realizing since the whole eviction and homelessness happened.

It's kind of like waking up in an abusive relationship and realizing the truth.

My entire life I have had unique and fantastic ideas of who I am and what my life could be. And always in my life the people around my would 'attach an anchor to keep me grounded'. It's all well and good to like books and art and music and games, but you have to be realistic about getting a real job, you have to work toward the house and the family and all the things that are realistic goals and the mark of a successful life.

And so I would wash dishes, or be a prep cook, stock shelves or anything along those lines. I'd allow myself the rebellion of creating things and exploring the creative spheres when nobody was watching and conspiring with other dreamers to be creative in hiding. Family would ask about what I'm up to and I would say nothing much, because they don't understand it and I don't want to try explaining abstract painting to people who have been blind all their lives and don't realize that we aren't all blind, and what we might get from such creations.

But these people are important to me. I will always set things down that are important to me, to be there and include them in my life. the creations are for me and they can happen anytime I'm alone with my things, but those people are not always available and I don't want them to ever feel they are not important to me.

But then everything got pulled out from under me... and I became suddenly aware of the fact that I wasn't important to any of them, and they wouldn't set anything important to them aside for me. And I've felt like such a fool for engaging in these asymetric relationships. But I've cared for them for so long that I'm not sure how to let go enough to stop putting my life aside for them, without completely abandoning them.

Part of the reason it's becoming more straining is simply because I have been so far away, and to so many places. I've met many other people and done things without anchors, and this fishbowl world I've returned to no longer is a cozy home port, as much as I want it to be. It's a place where some people know me, and things are familiar, but which hasn't really suited me for a long time.

But I'm still stuck with the awareness that even completely on my own, free to be me and do what I'm passionate about, that there are consequences for being too alien in places.

The awareness is that- "You are free. nobody spends any time thinking about or worrying about who you are and what you are doing. So, be you, and do what brings meaning to you." Running smack dab into, "These people would still burn witches, and everybody who thinks and acts differently is branded a pariah and never forgiven their sin of being different."

And I'm facing the fear of letting go the safe stifling place from which I came, to go and visit or seek a safe place in some stifling foreign place. And I'm scared of giving up and simply not caring anymore to the point of becoming a crazy recluse dressing in mascot costumes living inside a calliope because I've forsaken all anchors and have no references around me to tell me how far off I've wandered from human.

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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1680 on: March 25, 2019, 07:04:42 am »

Yeah. I can see why it would be different for me. But about the last 2/3 of your response seem strongly familiar to me. The difference is the standards your family held for you. My first 17 years were occupied by a very supporting environment. I was never afraid to tell them what I wanted to do. My 7th birthday cake was an airplane. They always supported what I wanted to do. It was the rest of the family here in the US, after I turned 18 that disappointed me. At first until I was 24, I ignored the situation.

My family on this side of the border became mostly nuclear. Very different from what I knew before I moved to the US. While in California, my uncle's family, all born in the US were decently polite when visiting from Texas. But after my grandmother passed away, once here in Texas, my uncle and family were a lot colder toward me than I expected. Initially downright repudiating me when my grandfather seemed close to death - and thereafter tolerating me when my grandfather miraculously recovered and even started a new business (kind of like a Lazarus Effect kind of thing. Inexplicable return to active life from what doctors claimed was advanced dementia or some such - it actually was a severe state of depression).

But when my grandfather fell ill again 14 years later, they turned the cold shoulder again. Even hostile at times. They placed my grandfather in a nursing home with power of attorney (my uncle is my grandfather's first born). It wasn't a sharp repudiation, as I kept going to Xmas dinners and such when my grandfather was still alive, but ignoring me after he died in the last 3 years to the point of no contact, even by email, even though we were in the same city. It's clear that the only thing that kept them tolerating me were my grandparents. With them gone, I'm a nobody.

All the cultural stuff I wrote in my previous post, is just my perspective of what I miss and knew in a past lifetime when my grandparents were still alive. Naturally it may not apply to you (or does it?  I don't know  exactly why not. Cultural family structure aside you can assimilate into any culture you want...the world is your oyster). For me it was just the "a-ha" moment when you realize there's nothing left for you here... I feel like I'm going home after 30 years of being in a war we lost, and I'm leaving my closest comrades behind, who died in battle, and I'm the only one left alive. I'm really sorry I have to leave their bodies behind. And I don't know what to expect really. I may just be going to another place to be lonely again. But I don't think I will let that happen. I do know people down there. At least there's one high-school buddy who I know will be happy to see me again  Cheesy as a seasoned adult, I know I'm alone and what I make of my life is all up to me. But I'll have at least someone to chat.

It's no different than staying here, except there's a better chance I will connect with people down there. Or let me put it to you this way; there are more people who like me down there than here where I am.

If I stay here, then I would have to resign to start a new life with all perfect strangers in a job environment that is shrinking for my age (and arguably just plain shrinking due to globalization), and living among a population who is increasingly turning hostile toward people from Mexico (never mind me trying to explain that I'm also not unlike my fellow Americans, that I have French and Italian roots - I've been told to my face that "I'm just another Mexican"). TBH after being attacked, I don't feel welcome in my own country. The silver lining is of course that somehow, the industry I was meant to join is now growing South of the Border. More aerospace engineers graduating from 11 colleges and universities in Mexico per year than the *whole* of the collegiate system in the US. Just try to wrap your mind around that! There were exactly zero aerospace graduates in Mexico 30 years ago when I left after high-school . If you would have told me that 30 years ago, I would have laughed in your face.

I will make a new family. I will try to make a meaningful contribution to the Aerospace industry somehow. I would like to see a graduating class of Mexican Aerospace Engineering students in person. If I was lucky enough, I would want to design and build something that will be truly revolutionary. Unheard of. What keeps me going and what occupies my mind today is the excitement of a possible new life.

I really hope you find your "a-ha" moment. I don't know what or when that will be. I would have thought that was the moment you realized that the relationship with your family was asymmetrical. But it sounds to me that your A-ha moment will involve you becoming a little bit more selfish, which is not necessarily a bad thing, and travelling a bit further away from the fishbowl.



Edited for typos (there still may be more!)
« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 11:04:54 pm by J. Wilhelm » Logged
Rose Inverness
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« Reply #1681 on: April 03, 2019, 12:44:32 am »


But these people are important to me. I will always set things down that are important to me, to be there and include them in my life. the creations are for me and they can happen anytime I'm alone with my things, but those people are not always available and I don't want them to ever feel they are not important to me.

But then everything got pulled out from under me... and I became suddenly aware of the fact that I wasn't important to any of them, and they wouldn't set anything important to them aside for me. And I've felt like such a fool for engaging in these asymetric relationships. But I've cared for them for so long that I'm not sure how to let go enough to stop putting my life aside for them, without completely abandoning them.

Part of the reason it's becoming more straining is simply because I have been so far away, and to so many places. I've met many other people and done things without anchors, and this fishbowl world I've returned to no longer is a cozy home port, as much as I want it to be. It's a place where some people know me, and things are familiar, but which hasn't really suited me for a long time.


Rovingjack,

I'm going through something SO SIMILAR. I won't go into all of it, just one aspect.

I had a 'best friend'. Now I don't. Simple as that. Over the past year or so I realized (after over a decade of friendship) that if I don't put in effort, she won't. At all. I was doing all the effort in the friendship. I'm not willing to do that anymore. Someone told me that the situation was unhealthy for me and that I could let go of her temporarily (which may or may not end up being temporary). Even that was hard, but I feel such a relief as a result. Even though it was to the point where we included each other in 'family' gatherings. It hurts, believe me, but the fact that I feel relief about letting her go her own way speaks volumes.

I am an intensely loyal and kind person. Yet it's ok that I can't do the painful part anymore where I expect that she will reach out and she doesn't for Months until I finally cave and reach out to find out if she's ok. And I've come to realize within maybe the past month that I deserve a friendship with someone who reaches out. I deserve better than what's been going on and I can look for it.

I'm trying to sympathize with you rather than instruct. Because you don't need advice, you need kindness and for people to truly listen and care about what you say (at least that's what it sounds like). I want all to be well for you. And I hope it soon will be.

~Mme. Rose Inverness

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rovingjack
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« Reply #1682 on: May 18, 2019, 03:15:12 am »

I discontinued hosting one group, and am on the verge of doing it with the other. The thing that sucks is that these are things I enjoy, and love to share with others and see their enjoyment of them too... but it comes to a point now when the day each month where I host these things has me anxious, stressed and pessamistic for the days leading up and hopeful the day of, only to be hurt and depressed.

The resulting emotional funk robs me of motivation and taints the things with a sense of 'nothing matters'.

But I'm also aware of the fact that giving up on these things doesn't resolve much of that, if I don't host anymore after this sunday, the next time that would be one of those meetings will roll around and I'll feel guilty for giving up on it, and hurt and depressed that I failed to save it.

Because in the long run I know people are interested in playing games and seeing what kinds of games people are creating, I know people are into arts and crafts and working with each other on projects and sharing them with each other. But somehow every effort I put into these things goes nowhere and I'm left sitting alone at a table.

but I'm kinda fed up with being the one left to feel that way, while everybody else gets to walk away feeling fine that there's always somebody else that will prop up this thing, so it will always be there when on a whim they can drop back in for a moment of being involved in that again.
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Cora Courcelle
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« Reply #1683 on: May 18, 2019, 12:22:38 pm »

It's always hard when others don't share our passions to the same degree, but if it's supposed to be fun and just isn't anymore seems to me that is the time to gently disengage; maybe come back to or restart it when you've had a chance to recharge your own creative/motivational battery.
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You have to tread a fine line between avant-garde surrealism and getting yourself sectioned...
Madasasteamfish
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« Reply #1684 on: May 22, 2019, 09:35:33 pm »

I'm really beginning to wonder what the f**k I'm even doing in life and why I'm even bothering to make any kind of effort...

About 6 months ago I approached my boss about my dissatisfaction with work as I didn't feel they were taking my complaints seriously, and wrre holding me to a higher standard than anyone else on team. In the interim I've had an occupational health assessment and made all sorts of attempts to explain what's going on in my head and what I need from them in order to do my job properly and I've got absolutely nowhere.

I've raised the same issue multiple times without anything being done to remedy it other than a gauge (and to my knowledge unfufilled) promise to speak to the relevant people and no my job is potentially at risk because of a couple of occasions where my frustration has totten the better of me and I've been swearing under my breath (at least one occasion was where my boss had put me in a situation they know I feel uncomfortable).

I mean if that wasn't bad enough they've also been demanding what is essentially impossible for me to deliver and that i make huge allowances for other people who's behaviour and actions are causing me no small amount of distress whilst not even showing a willingness to talk to those people about the impact they're having on me.
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I made a note in my diary on the way over here. Simply says; "Bugger!"

"DON'T THINK OF IT AS DYING, JUST THINK OF IT AS LEAVING EARLY TO AVOID THE RUSH."
Rose Inverness
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« Reply #1685 on: May 29, 2019, 11:26:02 pm »

It's always hard when others don't share our passions to the same degree, but if it's supposed to be fun and just isn't anymore seems to me that is the time to gently disengage; maybe come back to or restart it when you've had a chance to recharge your own creative/motivational battery.

I think Cora has a really good point here. My addition being that you could potentially put it on hold, saying something like 'No one's been attending, so I am putting this on hold until there is enough regular/weekly interest to make it worth continuing to host it.' Or.... 'If people reach out and express an interest in coming every week then I will host it, but if not then I will not be hosting this anymore.' Sometimes people just don't get it until it's taken away.

Thusly, I think it's very insightful of you, Rovingjack, to see that people tend to think of events spaces as being perpetually in existence. I know I am always shocked when something I enjoyed but hadn't been to in awhile disappears. But then I find myself wishing I'd made an effort to visit it more frequently. My point is that I think it is often entirely un-intentional. Many people don't even make a regular point of putting effort into caring for Themselves. I personally do what I can to change that in my corner of the world (aka self-care on a regular basis). I'm doing ok with that these days.

Madasasteamfish, can you look for another job in the meantime? If you don't have the energy, I have been there so I get that... It sounds like you are feeling unseen and disrespected. That's really hard. My husband dealt with that for a long time before we moved. I hear your struggle and I hope things get better soon.
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Madasasteamfish
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09madasafish
« Reply #1686 on: May 29, 2019, 11:52:07 pm »

Madasasteamfish, can you look for another job in the meantime? If you don't have the energy, I have been there so I get that... It sounds like you are feeling unseen and disrespected. That's really hard. My husband dealt with that for a long time before we moved. I hear your struggle and I hope things get better soon.

Thanks for the support. I had a HR meeting today and whilst that has reassured me to a degree since my job isn't at risk for the moment and my landlady (who happens to be a psychotherapist) has offered me some support forward, but I still feel the focus is being placed on the symptoms rather than the cause.

I've been looking at jobs elsewhere in the organisation and sector and plan to keep applying as I decided that even if things were totally resolved I'd be looking to move on in the next 6 months in order to continue with my professional development.
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Rose Inverness
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« Reply #1687 on: June 09, 2019, 12:58:26 am »

Madasasteamfish, That all sounds really hopeful. Glad to hear it.

Hope everyone else is well, too.

I just stopped in to say that it sucks when people treat sensitive people roughly! I know it's their own emotions and experience coloring their reaction, not really a statement on me personally. But I feel frustrated with it at the moment.

Been using Tara Brach's RAIN method lately when upset and it's working pretty well for me right now. Deconditioning the fight/flight response.
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Synistor 303
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« Reply #1688 on: June 09, 2019, 05:33:36 am »

Madasasteamfish, That all sounds really hopeful. Glad to hear it.

Hope everyone else is well, too.

I just stopped in to say that it sucks when people treat sensitive people roughly! I know it's their own emotions and experience coloring their reaction, not really a statement on me personally. But I feel frustrated with it at the moment.

Been using Tara Brach's RAIN method lately when upset and it's working pretty well for me right now. Deconditioning the fight/flight response.

I used to work for a company which had a lot of bullying amongst the office women. I'm sure they didn't think they were bullies... but they were nasty. When they left (there were 3 of them who thankfully went one after the other) I became the 'senior' office person, and I made sure the new women understood there was to be zero tolerance of bullying. The reactions of the new women when I explained this was one of complete delight, as every single one had a story of depression through work-place bullying. After that, it made for a really nice place to work. I think humans are very perceptive at picking out the sensitive people and sticking the boot in. I am not a sensitive soul, but don't ever bully anyone near me because it is like poking the bear with a stick. Me=bear.
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Cora Courcelle
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« Reply #1689 on: June 09, 2019, 09:11:17 pm »




 I'm sure they didn't think they were bullies...


Yes, the sort of people who always say "Why are you upset, it was just a joke" when you challenge them on their behaviour...
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Caledonian
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« Reply #1690 on: June 10, 2019, 12:13:11 am »

hey uhm
anyone got any advice on coping with a depressed and suicidal boyfriend? I love him dearly, and i really want to support him... but the fear of losing him is slowly eating away at me, too. it affects my sleep, makes me afraid that I may say the wrong thing one day and set him on a downwards spiral.
i really don't know what I'd do without him, because he has made me believe in myself and a future i, we, could have... where all my future plans ended after next year before.
anyway, I could use some advice I suppose...
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Madasasteamfish
A clanger waiting to be dropped......
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09madasafish
« Reply #1691 on: June 10, 2019, 08:50:04 am »

hey uhm
anyone got any advice on coping with a depressed and suicidal boyfriend? I love him dearly, and i really want to support him... but the fear of losing him is slowly eating away at me, too. it affects my sleep, makes me afraid that I may say the wrong thing one day and set him on a downwards spiral.
i really don't know what I'd do without him, because he has made me believe in myself and a future i, we, could have... where all my future plans ended after next year before.
anyway, I could use some advice I suppose...

I suppose, just being there for him would help a lot, and make him aware of the fact you're there, both physically and mentally/emotionally. Talking about it may help both of you, him just by being able to vent/explain his triggers and you by making him aware of the impact he's having on you and your relationship (which he may not be aware of), but you'd both have to be in the right head space for that, so as it doesn't devolve into an argument and make things worse.

Is he taking any kind of medication/therapy as they may help control things?
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rovingjack
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« Reply #1692 on: June 11, 2019, 04:07:48 am »

so the guy whose spare upstairs i stay at... when he doesn't have guests about every other month (and I have to empty out and disappear for a week with about 4 days notice)... and whose porch I helped rebuild for free, and his snow blower we rebuilt for free, and whose house I fix up a little at a time for free, and ... etc. started askiing for a little money from time to time back before winter but "it's not rent, it's just a little something to support the house from time to time." and so I kick him about 1400 over a few months. and right around when I made my trip for interviewing some people in Hawaii he starts asking me why can't I give them some of the money I'm spending on that trip instead? (the 500 dollars?)... and now he's accusing me of being late with rent and is pissed about what he thinks I owe him (claiming I should have paid him an additional 2000 by now).

But he knows he cannot legally rent this space because it's not up to code, and he also knows he couldn't ever find a renter for it because he would never rent to gay folks, and premarital sex is forbidden in his house, and so is alcohol, and he uses most of the upstairs for staining and finishing wood, and uses the kitchen in the upstairs when ever they want (thus walking through the space unannounced regularly).

So literally without me here, he gets nothing from this space. With me here he gets the place maintained and repaired (and a free consultant on managing his health concerns and a free maintainace and manager for when he leave the property). Yet here I am lately hitting the end of each month with less than 50 in my bank account, and he wants to talk about how much he thinks I should pay him...

we were friends once. I'm building my plans to figure out where I'm going to go off to, and then I'm done with him. Let him earn nothing and have the place sitting in ill repair and degrading without a maintainance man. I'm sick of so called friends moving the goal posts on agreements months in, and then digging into my pockets for  what they think is their share of my limited income.
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Fairley B. Strange
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« Reply #1693 on: June 12, 2019, 09:03:05 pm »

hey uhm
anyone got any advice on coping with a depressed and suicidal boyfriend? I love him dearly, and i really want to support him... but the fear of losing him is slowly eating away at me, too. it affects my sleep, makes me afraid that I may say the wrong thing one day and set him on a downwards spiral.
i really don't know what I'd do without him, because he has made me believe in myself and a future i, we, could have... where all my future plans ended after next year before.
anyway, I could use some advice I suppose...

Get him some professional help.
Seriously.
All the 'virtual hugs and support' we'll give you here on BG are great but they won't actually do squat if he decides to act on his suicidal ideation.
However, as a start, he has you - that's a better start than most guys in his situation have, so use it.
Find a suicide support counselling program (try your Uni student services) and take him there with you.
Even if he doesn't think that he's worth the time going, it will be you that's left behind crushed if he does do himself in, so make him go for your sake too, not just his.
Think of it as a form of couples counselling.
Goodluck.
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« Reply #1694 on: June 14, 2019, 06:54:21 am »

hey uhm
anyone got any advice on coping with a depressed and suicidal boyfriend? I love him dearly, and i really want to support him... but the fear of losing him is slowly eating away at me, too. it affects my sleep, makes me afraid that I may say the wrong thing one day and set him on a downwards spiral.
i really don't know what I'd do without him, because he has made me believe in myself and a future i, we, could have... where all my future plans ended after next year before.
anyway, I could use some advice I suppose...

Get him some professional help.

Seriously.
All the 'virtual hugs and support' we'll give you here on BG are great but they won't actually do squat if he decides to act on his suicidal ideation.
However, as a start, he has you - that's a better start than most guys in his situation have, so use it.
Find a suicide support counselling program (try your Uni student services) and take him there with you.
Even if he doesn't think that he's worth the time going, it will be you that's left behind crushed if he does do himself in, so make him go for your sake too, not just his.
Think of it as a form of couples counselling.
Goodluck.

I second the motion. However, there is a warning that I will pass on from my therapist when I dragged myself into the the psychologists office when I thought I was ready to go for suicide as a real option:

A relationship between two depressive people is deadly and MUST be avoided at all cost.

You see, I was encouraged to seek out relationships knowing full well that I could be severely hurt when they ended (because of my particular issues that are unique to my situation), but with the understanding I was under a psychologist's supervision who would pick me up so I could learn to let go of the relationship without feeling that my life "had ended."  It was a tough love approach to learning about real life and letting go (my problem was and still is more profound that that, I can't even approach people even allowing myself to become vulnerable for fear of being hurt, let alone letting go of someone, but the theoryoof the therapy was that after learning to trust, during the treatment I would have to learn to deal with getting hurt, otherwise you can't even have a relationship) .

However, the psychologist did sternly warn me about not seeking or frankly plain resisting the urge to seek out people like myself under the pretext of having common experiences, because, as she explained, two people with depression will drag each other down. Not only is it genetically inadvisable to bring together two depressive people, but in the immediate instance of a relationship it only brings misery and a potential for worsening of symptoms.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 09:58:40 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
Caledonian
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« Reply #1695 on: June 14, 2019, 12:19:12 pm »

hey uhm
anyone got any advice on coping with a depressed and suicidal boyfriend? I love him dearly, and i really want to support him... but the fear of losing him is slowly eating away at me, too. it affects my sleep, makes me afraid that I may say the wrong thing one day and set him on a downwards spiral.
i really don't know what I'd do without him, because he has made me believe in myself and a future i, we, could have... where all my future plans ended after next year before.
anyway, I could use some advice I suppose...

Get him some professional help.

Seriously.
All the 'virtual hugs and support' we'll give you here on BG are great but they won't actually do squat if he decides to act on his suicidal ideation.
However, as a start, he has you - that's a better start than most guys in his situation have, so use it.
Find a suicide support counselling program (try your Uni student services) and take him there with you.
Even if he doesn't think that he's worth the time going, it will be you that's left behind crushed if he does do himself in, so make him go for your sake too, not just his.
Think of it as a form of couples counselling.
Goodluck.

I second the motion. However, there is a warning that I will pass on from my therapist when I dragged myself into the the psychologists office when I thought I was ready to go for suicide as a real option:

A relationship between two depressive people is deadly and MUST be avoided at all cost.

You see, I was encouraged to seek out relationships knowing full well that I could be severely hurt when they ended (because of my particular issues that are unique to my situation), but with the understanding I was under a psychologist's supervision who would pick me up so I could learn to let go of the relationship without feeling that my life "had ended."  It was a tough love approach to learning about real life and letting go (my problem was and still is more profound that that, I can't even approach people even allowing myself to become vulnerable for fear of being hurt, let alone letting go of someone, but the theoryoof the therapy was that after learning to trust, during the treatment I would have to learn to deal with getting hurt, otherwise you can't even have a relationship) .

However, the psychologist did sternly warn me about not seeking or frankly plain resisting the urge to seek out people like myself under the pretext of having common experiences, because, as she explained, two people with depression will drag each other down. Not only is it genetically inadvisable to bring together two depressive people, but in the immediate instance of a relationship it only brings misery and a potential for worsening of symptoms.

he does have professional help. and i messaged a cpuncillor today, too. we were both alright when this relationship started, things just got bad because of outside factors. i refuse to leave him because of that.
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1696 on: June 14, 2019, 06:22:41 pm »

What I write is not an issue until you also get diagnosed with acute depressive disorder. Right now he's the only one with suicidal ideation. But the question will arise later. From what I've been told by people married to a depressive person, depressive people tend to love deeply but their partners must be very strong because they have to constantly lift them up emotionally. The opinion from two female psychiatrists I knew is that the relationship requires a lot of work and the non depressive parter needs a special personality, which does exist, BTW, there are people who handle it well.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2019, 06:26:12 pm by J. Wilhelm » Logged
Madasasteamfish
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09madasafish
« Reply #1697 on: June 20, 2019, 06:52:13 pm »

I really need a new job.  Sad

I keep trying to explain to my boss what I need from them and how they (and the rest of the team) help support me effectively because of my depression and anxiety, but I'm just getting nowhere. I mean they are literally asking the impossible of me, yet aren't prepared to listen to me explain why its' impossible. I honestly don't know what I'm supposed to do, or what they're expecting me to deliver, and my job is looking increasingly at risk simply because they're simply not prepared to make anything beyond a token effort.
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Cora Courcelle
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« Reply #1698 on: June 25, 2019, 08:22:02 pm »

I really need a new job.  Sad

I keep trying to explain to my boss what I need from them and how they (and the rest of the team) help support me effectively because of my depression and anxiety, but I'm just getting nowhere. I mean they are literally asking the impossible of me, yet aren't prepared to listen to me explain why its' impossible. I honestly don't know what I'm supposed to do, or what they're expecting me to deliver, and my job is looking increasingly at risk simply because they're simply not prepared to make anything beyond a token effort.

The problem is that while most employers pay lip service to the idea of supporting employees, in practice they are really only interested in things going smoothly with as little change to 'normal practices' as possible.  Usually the ones which have that 'Investor's in People' sign are actually the least flexible in their approach.
Which I realise is of no help whatsoever to you.
Is there anything you can suggest which will improve your position and help your employer improve performance in some way - the win/win scenario.  (Particularly if you can phrase it to sound as if you're thinking of their needs first and foremost, even though you are, very rightly, going for self preservation).
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Madasasteamfish
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09madasafish
« Reply #1699 on: June 25, 2019, 10:15:30 pm »

I really need a new job.  Sad

I keep trying to explain to my boss what I need from them and how they (and the rest of the team) help support me effectively because of my depression and anxiety, but I'm just getting nowhere. I mean they are literally asking the impossible of me, yet aren't prepared to listen to me explain why its' impossible. I honestly don't know what I'm supposed to do, or what they're expecting me to deliver, and my job is looking increasingly at risk simply because they're simply not prepared to make anything beyond a token effort.

The problem is that while most employers pay lip service to the idea of supporting employees, in practice they are really only interested in things going smoothly with as little change to 'normal practices' as possible.  Usually the ones which have that 'Investor's in People' sign are actually the least flexible in their approach.
Which I realise is of no help whatsoever to you.
Is there anything you can suggest which will improve your position and help your employer improve performance in some way - the win/win scenario.  (Particularly if you can phrase it to sound as if you're thinking of their needs first and foremost, even though you are, very rightly, going for self preservation).

Well to be brutally honest, the problem is my manager rather than my employer. The organisation I work for is actually quite good at the whole 'employee wellbeing' thing and offers various counselling, advice and support services etc.

The problem is that none of the resources available really feel applicable to my situation as they focus on the individual, and how to stop personal problems affecting their work. Whereas my difficulties are due to the effect of professional circumstances (essentially my role and place within the team and how other people/departments approach us and our work, or me specifically) upon my personal problems (i.e. my depression & anxiety).

Ultimately I just need my boss to do their job better and understand that just because something works for anyone and everyone else doesn't mean it'll work for me, and that they whilst they sometimes need to take a different approach with me, I don't need that to be to the point where they're focusing on me specifically.
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