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Author Topic: Victorian food brands still extant  (Read 185572 times)
J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1275 on: February 15, 2018, 12:23:15 am »

I prefer the first one made of wood.

Naturally. The family lived on the second floor. I'm sure they'd have the occasional early bird customer banging on the door in the morning. That building looks like by the 1940s(?) it was ready to keel over.
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« Reply #1276 on: February 15, 2018, 01:33:43 am »

What is this "HEB" of which you speak earthman?


Ah! I'm talking about the famed H. E. B. Grocery Co., originally established as the C. C. Butt Grocery Store in 1905 by Florence Thornton Butt in a small shop on the ground floor of her Victorian Era home in Kerrville, Texas. The company was named after her husband Charles C. Butt (but we can tell who was the boss there).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-E-B

I'm across the street from the H. E. B. on South New Braunfels & I'll be shopping there later- I'm at the McCreless library using the computer!
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« Reply #1277 on: February 15, 2018, 05:00:30 am »

What is this "HEB" of which you speak earthman?


Ah! I'm talking about the famed H. E. B. Grocery Co., originally established as the C. C. Butt Grocery Store in 1905 by Florence Thornton Butt in a small shop on the ground floor of her Victorian Era home in Kerrville, Texas. The company was named after her husband Charles C. Butt (but we can tell who was the boss there).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-E-B

I'm across the street from the H. E. B. on South New Braunfels & I'll be shopping there later- I'm at the McCreless library using the computer!



Well yes. There's practically one on every corner.  Grin
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Mercury Wells
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« Reply #1278 on: February 18, 2018, 02:09:32 am »

RE:- Stilton, here is the "first banned film in the UK /the world? (cheese mites)" 1903 No sound BtB.
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« Reply #1279 on: February 18, 2018, 02:15:41 am »

May or may not be in the British list (depends on Uncle Bert's decision)

No, I think not. Has been gone from British shelves for a long time. Dutch and Spanish it has become. I do wonder why they bought a brand and then closed it down. I've seen it happen many times.


They were doing a "The Producers" special?  Wink
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1280 on: February 18, 2018, 04:19:34 am »



Let the lantern of knowledge illuminate the world:





~~~

Also, I think I had mentioned this before, but for those of you interested in all foodstuff fermented and purposefully rotten, and who don't necessarily despise Japanese Manga or Animé, you might want to check the series (available either as Manga or Animé - and a live action series I need Japanese only), called Moyashimon (a/k/a "Tales of Agriculture"). It's about this college kid who is forced by his family to attend an agricultural university, on account he is the heir of a powerful wine and sake brewing company, and he is also gifted with the ability to see microorganisms with the naked eye, which is a particular advantage in his family business...
« Last Edit: February 18, 2018, 04:52:24 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1281 on: February 21, 2018, 06:09:03 am »

I prefer the first one made of wood.

I just got myself today a piece of that Danablu Danish Style Blue cheese at the super close to work. They had a special on cut slices. Wow! All I can say is that this is the dairy equivalent of a strong liquor. Alone it is very strong. And very good. Much stronger than most American blue cheeses I've had. Microscopic crumbs of the cheese are all you need to bring fireworks to Marinara sauce. As soon as I can I'll get some English Stilton as well.  The pungency of the cheese doesn't bother me that much. {Perhaps it's because I'm used to soft ripened French cheeses.
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yereverluvinunclebert
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« Reply #1282 on: February 21, 2018, 10:13:41 am »

It is strange to hear people worried about the smell of blue cheese. Cheeses over this side of the pond tend to be smelly by default. If it doesn't smell then it isn't real cheese. When you choose a Stilton, it is best to get a creamy one, if it is chalky then you have been sold an unripe dud.

Your Blue Stilton, in order to be called a Stilton has to be from one of these:

A) Colston Bassett Dairy

B) Cropwell Bishop

C) Hartington Creamery

D) Long Clawson Dairy

E) Tuxford & Tebbutt Creamery

F) Websters

There is also a Stichelton which isn't bad.

Stilton is best served as part of a Ploughmans with a pint of something decent.

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« Reply #1283 on: February 21, 2018, 08:57:36 pm »

It is strange to hear people worried about the smell of blue cheese. Cheeses over this side of the pond tend to be smelly by default. If it doesn't smell then it isn't real cheese. When you choose a Stilton, it is best to get a creamy one, if it is chalky then you have been sold an unripe dud.

Your Blue Stilton, in order to be called a Stilton has to be from one of these:

A) Colston Bassett Dairy

B) Cropwell Bishop

C) Hartington Creamery

D) Long Clawson Dairy

E) Tuxford & Tebbutt Creamery

F) Websters

There is also a Stichelton which isn't bad.

Stilton is best served as part of a Ploughmans with a pint of something decent.





Ah. I see:  A Plughman's Lunch
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ploughman%27s_lunch

I could look further into it, but I think the only one I've seen so far is Tuxford & Tebbutt.

I know I'll be enjoying the rest of the Danish Blue tonight in the meantime.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2018, 09:00:15 pm by J. Wilhelm » Logged
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« Reply #1284 on: February 27, 2018, 12:09:07 am »

What is this "HEB" of which you speak earthman?



Ah! I'm talking about the famed H. E. B. Grocery Co., originally established as the C. C. Butt Grocery Store in 1905 by Florence Thornton Butt in a small shop on the ground floor of her Victorian Era home in Kerrville, Texas. The company was named after her husband Charles C. Butt (but we can tell who was the boss there).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/H-E-B


I'm across the street from the H. E. B. on South New Braunfels & I'll be shopping there later- I'm at the McCreless library using the computer!



The truth is that HEB supermarkets will cater to every different community in a different way. You won't find the same products in all the supermarkets. When I was living in Cedar Park outside of Austin, I hated the supermarkets there because they'd never carry anything that was not hamburgers, BBQ beef, sausage, Cheddar, Colby, and Monterrey Jack. It was so difficult to find food for the holidays like Christmas, that I'd drive 10 miles south just to find things like imported wines and cheeses. Never mind Mexican food, they didn't even carry that since that is not a Hispanic part of the metro area. Unless of course you wanted to buy  hard "Taco Shells" and "Taco Sauce" (whatever that is).


In other news, I found more brands in my local super.

The first one I want to talk about, I have to be careful and note that while the product is touted to date back to 1883, the company that makes the cheese only dates back to 1920 (Their website is not too clear either). The argument is as follows: Ed Lapley was a teeneage employee at the Spring Dale Cheese Factory in Viola, Wisconsin in 1883. All generations following Mr. Lapley were cheese makers who worked at various factories in the region. Of Mr. Lapley's three children, Sarah and her husband bought the old factory where her father worked and that is when they fouded Carr Valley Cheese Co.  (Assuming I understand correctly). Later on, two of Sarah's children, Sam and Merna bought the Irish Valley Factory in Plain Wisconsin, in 1944, expanding the business...

http://www.carrvalleycheese.com/aboutus.asp



Carr Valley Cheddar Cheese (Originally produced by Ed Lapley at the Spring Dale Cheese Factory, Viola, Wisconsin, 1883, the factory was purchased and renamed by Ed's daugher Sarah in 1920)

~ ~ ~

The second American cheese brand I found, Roth Cheese, is actually a transplant from Switzerland, similar to the case of the British A1 Sauce, Morrel cold meats and Ghirardelli Chocolates, all of which started life outside of the United States, however unlike A1, the brand is still a bi-national Swiss-American brand. This means Roth cheese goes into both the European and American lists. I wouldn't be surprised to find that America's great love affair with Emmental style cheese (known here simply as "Swiss Cheese") is in great part due to Roth, given how early they started importing cheese into the United States - basically the start of the Civil War Era.

O. Roth & Cie. originally produced Emmentaler cheese and was founded by Oswald Roth, from Niedebipp, Switzerland in 1863. Mr. Roth moved to Zurich in the same year and started exporting Cheese to Europe and the Americas, including the United States (by the "rule of import," that qualifies the brand into the American list). However, in 1911, Otto Roth, a son of Oswald moved to New York City and founded Otto Roth & Co. as a importing company, full subsidiary of O. Roth & Cie. (this qualifies O. Roth & Cie. as a bi-national company). Eventually by 1989 the Swiss company would change it's name to Roth Kase AG, divesting some of it's branches to General Foods, and by 1990 the company would establish a factory under Roth Kase USA, in Monroe Wisconsin, thus completing the binational presence. In 2010 Roth Kase merged with Emmi as a transnational company.

http://www.rothcheese.com/our-story/

Roth Swiss (Emmentaler) Cheese  (Now known as Roth Kase AG and merged with Emmi,  it was originally founded in 1863 as O. Roth & Cie., by Oswald Roth in Niedebipp, Switzerland, this Emmentaller cheese making company exported cheese to the Americas and Europe starting in 1863 and later imported cheese to the United States under the subsidiary Otto Roth & Company, founded by Otto Roth in New York City, NY, in 1911. By 1990 Roth Kase USA was founded by Felix Roth and Fermo Jaeckle to produce cheese in Monroe, Wisconsin).


~ ~ ~

By the way, I also found some Barber's Cheddar Cheese, already included in the UK list


And a a second aside, I'll have to say that the Cheddar-style and Emmental-syle cheeses are two of the most consumed types of cheeses in the United States. Given that America is an immigrant nation and that British and Germanic people emmigrated into America in vast numbers, it is not surprising at all that Americans would consume these two types of cheeses and various permutations therof more than any other European variety of cheeses.


Compare:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_cheese
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emmental_cheese

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colby_cheese
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monterey_Jack
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheddar_cheese

There are differences between the European and American variants, but "American Swiss" is a lot closer to Emmentaler (it's basically a variant of Emmentaler), whereas Colby/Jack differs by way of a processing method that is bypassed (resting the curds under their own weight).

In general Americans prefer younger, softer and less aged cheese. I don't know if this is due to a need to simplify the production methods. A necessity in the Wild West? Or perhaps even as a biological difference in the ambient's biome - specifically the effect of ambiental mold which can change the process (since fementation is a basic step - this was very true for San Francico's Boudin Bakery - already on the list).

But even South of the Border you find other cases. In Mexico, fresh cheeses, like "Fresco" (comparable to Feta) and "Oaxaca" (a type of string cheese) are far more common, and the Spanish aged goat cheese Manchego, gave way to the cow-milk semi-hard Mexican Manchego. The very soft and creamy American "Monterey Jack" was originally made by Mexican monks in Monterey, California, and is in fact a soft unripened variant of Cheddar without Annato.

The same is true for other products throughout the Americas, specifically processed meats. Cold curing seems to be much less available in the United States and while available, not as frequent in Latin America, whereas cold curing is very much prevalent in Europe.

As a consequence people on this side of the pond consume products that are in general, less aged than European products... Food for thought.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2018, 01:57:50 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
Mercury Wells
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« Reply #1285 on: March 11, 2018, 01:13:04 pm »

Muskoka Springs est. 1873
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1286 on: March 11, 2018, 02:15:11 pm »


So you got water, eh?
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yereverluvinunclebert
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« Reply #1287 on: March 11, 2018, 07:57:07 pm »

Canada does. As part of the Empire I could claim it, however Canada can have it.
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1288 on: March 11, 2018, 08:12:41 pm »

Canada does. As part of the Empire I could claim it, however Canada can have it.

What ever happened to sharing?
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« Reply #1289 on: March 15, 2018, 04:05:27 pm »

May or may not be in the British list (depends on Uncle Bert's decision)

No, I think not. Has been gone from British shelves for a long time. Dutch and Spanish it has become. I do wonder why they bought a brand and then closed it down. I've seen it happen many times.


They were doing a "The Producers" special?  Wink

Perhaps they wanted it off the shelves because it would compete with a product that they were making or planning?
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« Reply #1290 on: March 15, 2018, 08:02:08 pm »

May or may not be in the British list (depends on Uncle Bert's decision)

No, I think not. Has been gone from British shelves for a long time. Dutch and Spanish it has become. I do wonder why they bought a brand and then closed it down. I've seen it happen many times.


They were doing a "The Producers" special?  Wink

Perhaps they wanted it off the shelves because it would compete with a product that they were making or planning?

I'm not sure it works that way. Usually a company will buy a brand to expand it's market to other countries. But the scheme doesn't always work if the domestic market was poor already at the time of purchase. Then the new owners have the make the hard choice of closing the brand alltogether on two markets. If sales outside of the original country outperform the domestic sales, the parent company may opt to keep the brand in the new country- assuming they have factories set up in the new country. This was true for Morell meats, Gray Poupon Mustard, and A1 Sauce, which suffered the same fate. In fact, I's say that is probably the most common situation.

People can inflate the value of a brand if they peceive it is of a high quality. To the French, as Uncle Bert wrote, mustard is mustard. To the Americans, a French brand of mustard is "fancy." Hence Grey Poupon survived in America.

Mexicans, for example, have placed the Sony Electronics brand on a pedestal for many decades since the 1970s. During the VHS vs Betamax Video Tape battle in the 80s, Mexico was one of the last few countries to let go of Betamax, while the rest of the world switched to VHS. And in the 1990s, when the Mexican government sold the national phone company back to Ericsson, the original Swedish owner, after it had been nationalised in the 1940s, Sony took note of the high esteem people held both brands in Mexico and various other countries, and formed a partnership company, "Sony-Ericsson" to market mobile phones and laptops. Ericsson rode on the Sony brand reputation, and Sony enjoyed the monopoly of rebuilding the communications networks for an entire country. It was a marketing plot designed to exploit people's perceptions and create a near-monopoly in consumer electronics.
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« Reply #1291 on: March 16, 2018, 05:33:11 pm »

I'm from the Georgia (USA) and have been fond of some Victorian/ British foods.

I have started drinking hot cocoa instead of coffee (partly for medical reasons), old fashioned crackers/biscuits, preparing and eating mushy peas, making my version of brown sauce, curing back bacon [OMG!!!] and although not Victorian Jammie Dodgers when I can get them.

I get all kind of strange looks from my friends, that is until I can get them to try it.
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« Reply #1292 on: March 16, 2018, 05:44:04 pm »

Keep going, step by step we'll turn you into a Steampunk Brit. Review the list and start purchasing!
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« Reply #1293 on: March 16, 2018, 06:42:16 pm »

Campbell Soups was founded in 1869.

The original business name was Anderson & Campbell of Camden, New Jersey, & "Beefsteak Tomatoes" were their first canned product.
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1294 on: March 16, 2018, 09:17:56 pm »

Campbell Soups was founded in 1869.
(snip) "Beefsteak Tomatoes" were their first canned product.

They need to bring back that name  Cheesy

I'm from the Georgia (USA) and have been fond of some Victorian/ British foods.

I have started drinking hot cocoa instead of coffee (partly for medical reasons), old fashioned crackers/biscuits, preparing and eating mushy peas, making my version of brown sauce, curing back bacon [OMG!!!] and although not Victorian Jammie Dodgers when I can get them.

I get all kind of strange looks from my friends, that is until I can get them to try it.

As you can see, we do get a number of British brands here. You probably should review all the lists. Which reminds me I have to revide the US list, wjich was left behind a bit back ago.

Though I have no clue which supermarkets in Georgia would be good for imports.
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« Reply #1295 on: March 17, 2018, 03:21:03 am »

Though I have no clue which supermarkets in Georgia would be good for imports.

The best sources, at least local here in Bremen, has been Ingles, and Publix.
There is also Whole Foods and a meat market called Patak's Bohemian Meats that I go to that carries a lot of imported European products. As far as meat products Patak's makes what they can't import blood sausages, bangers and OMG! Krakowska!!!
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1296 on: March 17, 2018, 07:05:47 am »

Though I have no clue which supermarkets in Georgia would be good for imports.

The best sources, at least local here in Bremen, has been Ingles, and Publix.
There is also Whole Foods and a meat market called Patak's Bohemian Meats that I go to that carries a lot of imported European products. As far as meat products Patak's makes what they can't import blood sausages, bangers and OMG! Krakowska!!!

Ah yes. Whole Foods is Austin's gift to the rest of the US With Amazon buying it, I expect prices to be lowered - because it tends to be on the pricey side... Patak's Bohemian sounds interesting.
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Will Howard
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« Reply #1297 on: March 19, 2018, 06:23:21 pm »

It is strange to hear people worried about the smell of blue cheese. Cheeses over this side of the pond tend to be smelly by default. If it doesn't smell then it isn't real cheese. When you choose a Stilton, it is best to get a creamy one, if it is chalky then you have been sold an unripe dud.

Stilton is best served as part of a Ploughmans with a pint of something decent.

JUST a pint?
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« Reply #1298 on: March 19, 2018, 06:33:35 pm »

Of course. It is for lunch and one must have some decency. Staggering out of a pub, drunk into the daylight is not recommended. A pint is sufficient.
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #1299 on: March 21, 2018, 07:05:05 am »

I gouda mentioned something about it before, but I was reminded today of this brand, while I was having dinner.

The dinner is penne pasta with meatballs, covered in 5 cheese cream sauce with sautéed sweet onions and Balsamic vinegar, and then topped with a slice of Emmental cheese (a/k/a "Swiss" for Americans), and shavings of smoked Gouda.

The brand of the Dutch Gouda cheese is Kroon, who claim to date back to 1831.

I still need more details as their website lacks specifics... The website does not mention which type of cheese was made by them back in 1831, but I'm assuming it would be the local variety, whichever location was closer to them at the time, Maasdam, Edam, or Gouda. So I can only pinpoint the company's present location but not their site of origin.

I hate it when companies claim a certain pedigree and then they don't back it up with history.

https://www.krooncheese.com/


« Last Edit: March 21, 2018, 07:56:59 am by J. Wilhelm » Logged
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