|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« on: January 06, 2012, 05:38:12 am » |
|
When I was last playing in the blacksmith shop I whipped this up. Just found it while clearing out some stuff that I had put away so I would rmember where it was. Then forgot where it was.  That is about an 86 layer patternweld and twist bracelet.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
If at first you don't succeed , CHEAT!
|
|
|
|
Hez
|
 |
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2012, 08:22:06 am » |
|
I like the striations, how did you achieve that? er... That is about an 86 layer patternweld and twist bracelet. nemmind
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: January 06, 2012, 08:23:45 am by Hez »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2012, 03:31:11 pm » |
|
Just stack the steel get it hot and beathelloutait!
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2012, 01:03:54 am » |
|
Pattern welding (related to "Damascus steel") is an antique method of layering iron & case-hardened iron or steel so that the steel is distributed throughout the fabric of the metal. Only way to guarantee uniformity of the metal when it is being forged from bog iron nodules or old scrap metal. Invention of the Bessemer process (blast furnace) is what rendered this obsolete. Shotgun barrels (ever hear of a "Damascus barreled" shotgun?) were made this way into the twentieth century. They are beautiful, but not safe with anything but black powder ammunition, Modern ammunition with smokeless powder produces too much pressure & the barrels can unwind spectacularly.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"I'm a Barbarian by choice, not ancestry..."
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2012, 05:46:59 am » |
|
The welding process also creates carbon migration. This helps to equalize the carbon content to some extent. Without looking it up I can't remember just how many folds and welds are required to get a homogenous product. Before Bessemer the common steel was created by the blister steel process. Essentially cementation. Iron was packed into large crucibles with carbon materials(Very often bone charcoal) and held at high heat for an extended period. Upon removal it was covered in blisters of steel. Hence the name. A fold and welding of the original blister steel produced shear steel which wan of a better quality. Further work produced double shear and finally razor steel. The last being the best quality and having the optimum carbon distribution.
The world of ferrous metals through time is a fascinating study. Once the new shop is moved in and up for work I will be experimenting with making tools of wrought iron having welded in steel edges. I have done some but am not yet completely happy with the result.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Hez
|
 |
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2012, 06:02:53 am » |
|
I heard a theory that the origin of the myth of Arthur pulling the sword from the stone to become king was the apparent magic of those first able to cast metal swords in a stone or clay mold.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2012, 06:57:31 am » |
|
I heard a theory that the origin of the myth of Arthur pulling the sword from the stone to become king was the apparent magic of those first able to cast metal swords in a stone or clay mold.
Since casting or forging large iron objects such as an anvil would have been a lost art by the "Dark Ages"/Early Middle Ages, metal anvils were very small & used mainly for finishing work. The rough forging was done on large, flat, smooth stones. In some versions of the Authurian legends, he pulls the sword from a stone, in others, he pulls it from an anvil. I believe that the stone WAS the anvil, & that the two variants of the legend are simply misinterpretation of the same story.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2012, 07:44:32 am » |
|
From my study of ancient Norse metal work , I think you are on the right track there Will. A cast iron sword would have been WAY to high in carbon and extremely brittle. If it were a cast sword it would have been bronze, taking the story back many centuries to the bronze age.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2012, 04:29:49 pm » |
|
From my study of ancient Norse metal work , I think you are on the right track there Will. A cast iron sword would have been WAY to high in carbon and extremely brittle. If it were a cast sword it would have been bronze, taking the story back many centuries to the bronze age.
Thank you, Uncle Arthur. Cast iron is notoriously brittle & breaks are hard to repair, even with thermite welding. Perhaps the "newer" tig or mig welders make it easier.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Narsil
|
 |
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2012, 04:45:07 pm » |
|
The standard way to weld cast iron is with high nickel content electrodes which produced a weld which is ductile enough to allow the casting to contract as it cools without cracking. It's this thermal expansion combined with cast iron's brittleness which causes most of the problems with welding, preheating can also help to alleviate the problem as can peening the welds as they cool. Some cast iron welds are trickier than others, depending on what stresses are set up in the metal.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|

A man of eighty has outlived probably three new schools of painting, two of architecture and poetry and a hundred in dress. Lord Byron
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2012, 04:50:12 pm » |
|
Thank you, Narsil. As you can probably tell, I have some knowledge with metalworking, but little experience with some facets of it.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2012, 06:05:52 am » |
|
Narsil is spot on about the preheating. I have welded quite thin forge pans with moderate success by preheating and post heating then covering everything with insulation to prevent thermal shock from too rapid cooling.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2012, 04:39:52 pm » |
|
Ashes make good insulation, if you have enough. I have used (clean) kitty litter for insulation when annealing hardened parts for drilling.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2012, 05:16:43 am » |
|
Ashes make good insulation, if you have enough. I have used (clean) kitty litter for insulation when annealing hardened parts for drilling.
Bury the parts of the item that you DON'T want annealed in the ashes or kitty litter with the area to be softened exposed. Heat red hot, & quickly push the still glowing piece deep into the insulating agent. Let it cool on its own, slowly. I have done this in a tuna can with a propane torch, to heat a revolver loading gate that I needed to drill a pivot hole in. Worked beautifully.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2012, 12:12:36 pm » |
|
As a smith I always have a bucket of ashes below the forge that serves yeoman duty for annealing.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Katie
Deck Hand
 United States
Steampunk Fledgeling
|
 |
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2012, 12:56:19 am » |
|
That is absolutely gorgeous...
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2012, 12:03:10 am » |
|
Thank you Katie.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Alfaya
Deck Hand
 Spain
Steampunk connoisseur and photography alchemist.
|
 |
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2012, 11:16:33 am » |
|
The standard way to weld cast iron is with high nickel content electrodes which produced a weld which is ductile enough to allow the casting to contract as it cools without cracking. It's this thermal expansion combined with cast iron's brittleness which causes most of the problems with welding, preheating can also help to alleviate the problem as can peening the welds as they cool. Some cast iron welds are trickier than others, depending on what stresses are set up in the metal. Ummm... very interesting (and quite different from silver welding). I should do some research about this topic. (By the way, nice patterns on the bracelet surface) Many thanks for sharing your knowledge, Gentlemen! 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #18 on: May 06, 2012, 03:08:17 am » |
|
The standard way to weld cast iron is with high nickel content electrodes which produced a weld which is ductile enough to allow the casting to contract as it cools without cracking. It's this thermal expansion combined with cast iron's brittleness which causes most of the problems with welding, preheating can also help to alleviate the problem as can peening the welds as they cool. Some cast iron welds are trickier than others, depending on what stresses are set up in the metal. Ummm... very interesting (and quite different from silver welding). I should do some research about this topic. (By the way, nice patterns on the bracelet surface) Many thanks for sharing your knowledge, Gentlemen!  Thank you sir. Welding cast with a stick welder is both an art and a craft as I do it. A lot of luck is involved when you don't have the proper measuring devices to give you exact temps. The patterns achieved in pattern welding are a lot of fun to work with. You can do a lot of amazing things by manipulating your welded bar before flattening and grinding.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Alfaya
Deck Hand
 Spain
Steampunk connoisseur and photography alchemist.
|
 |
« Reply #19 on: May 06, 2012, 11:59:00 am » |
|
Thank you sir. Welding cast with a stick welder is both an art and a craft as I do it. A lot of luck is involved when you don't have the proper measuring devices to give you exact temps. Many thanks for your kind answer. You cannot be more right about this, sir  The patterns achieved in pattern welding are a lot of fun to work with. You can do a lot of amazing things by manipulating your welded bar before flattening and grinding. It sounds amazing, we need to try that with silver 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Will Howard
|
 |
« Reply #20 on: May 06, 2012, 03:20:50 pm » |
|
Thank you sir. Welding cast with a stick welder is both an art and a craft as I do it. A lot of luck is involved when you don't have the proper measuring devices to give you exact temps. It sounds amazing, we need to try that with silver  The Japanese technique called Mokume takes layers of silver (sterling &/or German silver), copper, brass & perhaps nickel & gold (if you could afford it) & they are soldered together. Then the resultant sheet or bar of laminate is hammered, rolled, & ground to create a textured, irregular surface. This is similar to pattern welding, but gives a whole different, multicolored appearance.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Alfaya
Deck Hand
 Spain
Steampunk connoisseur and photography alchemist.
|
 |
« Reply #21 on: May 06, 2012, 04:25:42 pm » |
|
The Japanese technique called Mokume takes layers of silver (sterling &/or German silver), copper, brass & perhaps nickel & gold (if you could afford it) & they are soldered together. Then the resultant sheet or bar of laminate is hammered, rolled, & ground to create a textured, irregular surface. This is similar to pattern welding, but gives a whole different, multicolored appearance.
Dear Mr Howard, I have been doing some research and I can only tell you one thing: we are definitely going to try Mokume tehnique. Thank you so much for your suggestion!!! 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #22 on: May 06, 2012, 09:41:41 pm » |
|
I have run across several sites detailing the process of mokume and have made a couple of attempts. My best luck has been with a stack of US quarters..
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Alfaya
Deck Hand
 Spain
Steampunk connoisseur and photography alchemist.
|
 |
« Reply #23 on: May 07, 2012, 06:54:07 pm » |
|
I have run across several sites detailing the process of mokume and have made a couple of attempts. My best luck has been with a stack of US quarters..
Are there photos available? I would love to see them! 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Uncle Arthur
|
 |
« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2012, 02:31:57 am » |
|
Sorry . I didn't shoot any and the piece is long gone. Will do a full set next attempt.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|