this is an outrage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[nicromanov]

today i drove for three hours to Broadstone Mill ,after being given a flyer about a steampunk exhibition and craft fair ,when i arrived ,what i found was an empty room full of very empty cubicles.
it appears that whoever was planning to host the event decided not to go ahead with it ,and did not inform anyone of this .
i simply needed to vent my rage ,thankyou for your time

[TimeTinker]

Did you get the flyer at The Asylum Nicromanov?

[nicromanov]

indeed, i understand you cannot contact everyone who took a flyer ,but a simple post on a couple of steampunk forums would have made it all alot easier .

[TimeTinker]

I am very sorry that you were misled and had a wasted journey.  It is indeed unacceptable and it would have been the work of moments to announce that the exhibition was indeed cancelled.  Whilst waiting for your reply I have made a few enquiries and done a little bit of research.

In order to avoid being elitist or being accused of attempting to dominate and control steampunk in the UK the VSS has from its inception had the policy that we will actively support other events, help to promote them etc.  This also means that we allow people to fly post at The Asylum.

The "show" in question was being organised by Andrew Craven who was employed at the Gallery.  We did have some misgivings about the gallery's conduct and motives but even so we allowed Andrew to flyer at The Asylum.   I understand he may have parted company with them since but obviously neither he nor the gallery have announced that the exhibition was cancelled.  We certainly had no idea that the exhibition was not going ahead.

It does beg the question of whether we should allow people to flyer and promote at VSS events (which automatically confers a certain "respectability" off the back of our hard earned reputation) or how we should vet or monitor such events.  The same may be said of the British Facebook Community group on facebook which I set up to share information about events.

Comments are invited.

Once again sincere apologies Nicromanov.  Even though the event is nothing whatsoever to do with us and we have no responsibility for the running of it it is most disappointing that the Asylum was the venue where you obtained the flyer.

[nicromanov]

i think to say people cannot flyer would be tragic ,i simply think people should probably make sure there events are well ,acctualy events ,befor handing out flyers.
thankyou for your help ,i shall do a little more research into it next time

[Mr Peter Harrow, Esq]

Oh dear, the problem in refusing to allow people to promote their events at your events is that you are considered to be elitist.

In SF when an event is cancelled it goes up on the website immediately (a website is a must for any major event organizer) and posted as such on Ansible (the news site). I remember the cancellation of Convoy, the Chair turned up at the preceding Novacon, with cheques for returned memberships and apologised in person to every member present. A true gentleman (or gentlewoman in this case), and what I would do if I found myself in this position.

Was there anything on the Galleries web-site to suggest cancellation? Did Mr Craven seek to alert anyone? I abhor Facebook, but I don't remember a thread on the UK child Board for this in Geographical.

All that can done is when someone has shown themselves not to be a gentleman, we refuse to deal with them in future. To that extent Sir you have done a public service in alerting the rest of us to this. One can hope no one has entrusted exhibits to this 'exhibition' and are wondering what has happened to them. One shudders to think about it.

[nicromanov]

i found nothing in the geographical thread about this ,the facebook page did not show any signs of cancellation ,and the gentleman in question appears to have not allerted the gallerie of his events cancellation.
i will say tjis even will not stop me seeking events or picking up flyers ,i will simply do a little more research befor devotiong my time to something .

[Madasasteamfish]

If I may be permitted to interject good people it seems that the fault lies with the exhibition organisers for not distributing information about the cancellation of the event. I understand how this may well reflect badly upon the VSS, since they allowed the flyers to be distributed at one of their events. The best solution for situations for occurrences such as this would possibly be to alert the community to such outrages (a la the golden and broken cogs awarded to certain local businesses following the asylum).

[Mr Peter Harrow, Esq]

Every so often we get someone new to SP thinking they can re-organize everyone how THEY want, and they are studiously ignored. In this case, not quite so.

 Things like Comicons and Expo's will not allow flyering of queues, partly for littering, but partly because they do not want to be associated with something they cannot control trading off their reputation. I don't think the Major wants the VSS put in this position, and should anyone seek to trade off the reputation of the VSS or The Asylum, I would be happy to lend my legal services to rectify the situation.

[nicromanov]

i in no way want anyone t stop flyering ,i wish to make that clear ,in fact i love being handed flyers and leaflets for anything .
i have no issues with the asylum or vss ,my issue is with the organiser of this particular event.
the only legal advise i need is can i claim the petrol money back from him ?

[TimeTinker]

Thank you Peter that is a very kind offer.

I am sure people realise we had nothing whatsoever to do with this non event but I do feel guilty in that I had quite serious doubts about the motives of the gallery which was hosting the exhibition (I fear that to a degree Andrew may have been almost duped by them - he was being paid by the gallery to organise the exhibition and when they parted company they simply conveniently forgot about the work he had already done).  Even so we permitted Andrew to distribute the flyers because to have denied him the opportunity would have been contrary to our policies about facilitating steampunk and not controlling it.

Of course hindsight is a wonderful thing. Perhaps we were being too open and even handed. Possibly we were naieve.  Perhaps we couldn't have done anything any differently.

Should we continue to allow people to promote at VSS events without vetting them?  In which case we would need to make clear our policy to Asylum goers and stress that we do not endorse or support any such events?

Should we vet the bona fides of people wishing to promote/flyer etc and curtail anyone's activities that does not meet our "criteria" whatever these may prove to be?

Is there another policy we can adopt?

(Note -A broken cog for the gallery is probably an excellent idea. Not sure where though since the existing ones are intended as a guide for The Asylum not steampunk in the wider UK.)

[nicromanov]

i belive a simple trust system is the best policy ,let people flyer ,but make them aware that if they fail to keep people informed about changes to the event ,then they are to be held responsible .
seems reasonable to me ,and im sure it would make people think long and hard about simply declaring an event and not keeping it organised or up to date.

[Flynn MacCallister]

TimeTinker, for the sake of your own reputation, having your own logo to put onto the flyers and posters of VSS-endorsed events and making it clear that any material not carrying your logo is not associated with or endorsed by you seems like a decent idea, if you don't do it already...

[Mr Peter Harrow, Esq]

A disclaimer on the VSS and Asylum sites along the the lines of "Whilst the VSS are prepared to allow for the promotion of third party events at its functions, the VSS does not endorse any such third party event and does not accept any responsibilty in respect of any such third party events cancellation. The VSS reserves the right to withdraw third party event promotion rights from any member attending its functions should this result in a nuisance to its membership, or the promotion would reflect adversely upon the VSS or persons attending its functions"

That should cover most eventualities.

As regards petrol money the lack of consideration passing would stop you having a contract claim, unless you can apply Carlill v Carbolic Smokeball Company in showing that travelling to the gallery was consideration on you part (the Victorian's had all sorts of weird contract claims) a tortious claim may exist under negligent misstatement, but I do not doubt the gallery have a disclaimer themselves.

[TimeTinker]

Good plan Flynn.  Now we just need a logo

Having an "official" logo should convey our endorsement of an event and make clear things are nothing to do with us.

We shall endeavour to implement this forthwith.  Thank you for the suggestion.

The disclaimer Peter is also excellent.  Thank you Sir.

We may get some positive outcomes from this debacle it seems.

[Narsil]

Thank you Peter that is a very kind offer.

I am sure people realise we had nothing whatsoever to do with this non event but I do feel guilty in that I had quite serious doubts about the motives of the gallery which was hosting the exhibition (I fear that to a degree Andrew may have been almost duped by them - he was being paid by the gallery to organise the exhibition and when they parted company they simply conveniently forgot about the work he had already done).  Even so we permitted Andrew to distribute the flyers because to have denied him the opportunity would have been contrary to our policies about facilitating steampunk and not controlling it.

Of course hindsight is a wonderful thing. Perhaps we were being too open and even handed. Possibly we were naieve.  Perhaps we couldn't have done anything any differently.

Should we continue to allow people to promote at VSS events without vetting them?  In which case we would need to make clear our policy to Asylum goers and stress that we do not endorse or support any such events?

Should we vet the bona fides of people wishing to promote/flyer etc and curtail anyone's activities that does not meet our "criteria" whatever these may prove to be?

Is there another policy we can adopt?

(Note -A broken cog for the gallery is probably an excellent idea. Not sure where though since the existing ones are intended as a guide for The Asylum not steampunk in the wider UK.)

Perhaps a dedicated area or stand  for 'open' flyers and posters with the clear disclaimer that this is a service not an endorsement and only allow general distribution for events and organisations that are 'officially endorsed'.

There is certainly a danger that, at an organised event people have a tendency to fall into the mindset of being in a controlled and safe environment and are much more likely to take things at face value, especially if that event already has a good reputation.

On the other hand its hard to see supporting other events as a bad thing in itself but perhaps a clearer distinction between information and endorsement would benefit everyone.

Edit: It would also seem reasonable to require all publicity to include contact information to allow people to check that the event is still on beforehand, either an e-mail, phone number or equivalent in addition to a web/facebook page . Any halfway reputable event should have this anyway. 

[TimeTinker]

Excellent suggestion Narsil.

In this way we can keep our policy of openess by making a distribution area available but can also control flyering to a degree (thus avoiding litter etc).

Coupled with an "endorsement logo" and the disclaimers/notices suggested and we have a coherent policy.

One for the next full VSS meeting I feel.

Thank you all for your input.

[Outflyer_Calliope]

Having been an associate of Andrews for some time, I'll step forward in his absence and do my best to explain his position to the best of my knowledge.

Andrew was hired by the gallery, specifically for promotion of a steampunk event The Gallery  was interested in running (and making money from). Andrew and the gallery parted ways, leaving him without payment and the Gallery with an event they didn't know how to organise. Apparently they decided to call it off.

Having only been hired to act as a consultant for an event being undertaken by the gallery, we can assume that Andrew had no further control thereafter of how the event proceeded and was promoted.
I can assure you he is not the type of person to walk out on something like this, and had the event been under his control, things would have been different.

However he cannot post an event has been cancelled if he has nothing to do with the people organising it any longer. One can assume he found out at the same time we did.

the only legal advise i need is can i claim the petrol money back from him ?

From a legal stand point, as the organisers of the event, the gallery would be held responsible if you wished to take it further.

[TimeTinker]

Thanks for the reply.  You confirm the situation as I beleived it to be and had posted it.  I warned Andrew when he was first talking about the exhibition that I did not like the way the gallery were doing things, it felt exploitative and they have shown themselves to be less than honourable if they have not paid him for his work.  I think we may be wise to have nothing whatsoever to do with the place in future.

[Outflyer_Calliope]

No worries, I would hate to see anyone’s name tarnished by the acts of another.
Especially people like those who own and work at the gallery in question... definitely a broken cog sort of place.

[andrew craven]

Dear all
 I am immensely sad to hear the chaos at hand with regards to the steampunk exhibition I was originally appointed to organise. I did put a wall notice on the facebook page for it telling of the cancellation. I do take part of the responsibility as I have realised that I could have done more in way of communication such as using Brass Goggles.

 It was an inappropiate affair that cancelled the exhibition. A month after flyering at the Lincoln event, I had an unnotified meeting with the organisers of the Future Job Fund scheme who got me the position in the gallery in the first place. It turned out that Catherine Sheppard, the gallery's manager, complained to them about my dissagreement with her about me going to the Assylum. After having me organise the flyer, knowing full well I was to take them to the Assylum, she decided to tell me that the gallery does not fund the printing afterall and it was down to me to find two sponsors to pay for it which she was wanting me to obtain at the Assylum. I dissagreed with her as it was going back on our original incentive that she decided to take as confrontational as I was to discover a month later. Those flyers I used in the end were quick ones knocked up on microsoft office that I printed out on their inkjets printers so I had something to give out atleast. I did not bother with asking for sponsors.
 In my defence she did not once discuss about this incident in that month leading up to the interview. But I must say, not only this, but the way she handled things in that gallery and the way she had me attend this meeting on false pretences, not to mention the content of it, I am confident to note her caprices and complacency. In the end it was her word against mine and I didnt have a leg to stand on. They concluded that I was not eligible for a position that required customer service because of that dissagreement. And so they removed my remit in the gallery which meant that I was to no longer organise the show. In other words cancelled.
 
 Once again I must sincerely apologise for any inconveniences, I do not how to express it more!
Yours
Andy
 

[nicromanov]

that apology is more than enough for me ,all is forgiven
tea anyone?

[Lucius Voltaic]

that apology is more than enough for me ,all is forgiven
tea anyone?

I've got a box of B. Fuller's Lavender Grey, let's have a party!

[Madasasteamfish]

Sounds most excellent to me.

[nicromanov]

indeed bourbon biscuit anyone?