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Author Topic: how to age metal?  (Read 24783 times)
sidecar_jon
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« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2009, 01:58:27 pm »

It is verdigris, sort of not attached especially well to the copper and in places powdery, the trouble with fixing it is the "wetting out" effect makes it darker. One thing i have noticed is that another bowl that was sprayed with Silicon polish resisted me trying to get the polish off by brush/detergent etc and didn't work half as well.
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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2009, 02:02:38 pm »

Have to  try that as well as that bowl looks such a vivid beautiful colour  Grin

Your in the best position to reproduce it ... Lidels plant food. ( i dont think they have spread to the USA yet) that's on raw copper from a water tank.
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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #27 on: May 21, 2009, 01:03:14 pm »

This morning i notice Lidels have some nice propane touches with a trigger etc claiming to produced a flame 2000C but then claim 800c working temperature of metal...?
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Lady Sandrine
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« Reply #28 on: May 27, 2009, 06:03:08 am »

Brown or black shoe polish can be used to give an antique look to some metals.
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Ginny Blundy
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« Reply #29 on: May 27, 2009, 09:23:12 pm »

I'm here from a limited network, so I'm not able to see if Mina has posted any pictures. For this reason, forgive me if this comment is completely unnecessary for reasons that a picture would make clear, but:

Verdigris is poisonous, so you don't want to ingest it and you don't want it mixing with your bloodstream. Even if the post of the earring is stainless steel, I personally would not be happy with verdigris built up right next to the post, if I were the one using these earrings. If these are hook-style earrings, I think it would be fine as long as you coat the ornamental end with polyurethane or something after achieving a patina, so that you aren't getting verdigris all over the hook when you handle them.

Come to mention it, I wonder if there's ever been a safety thread started. I will have to search for this. It sounds like an excellent candidate for stickiness.
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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #30 on: May 27, 2009, 10:08:21 pm »

yes its poison, i asked a research chemist friend just how poison it was and his best response was "a bit"... His advice was don't eat it, but plenty of people wear raw copper bracelets (for rheumatism) and their wrists go green, and they don't seem to die of it. Looking on the web it seems to be characterised as a "irritant poison" and ingestion seems to be treated with milk of egg whites. (legend has it that eggs beat up to a froth better in a copper bowl... wonder if that has anything to do with it) it seems to basically give your the "trots". It was even used at time to colour Absinthe!..So my advice is its a "bit poison".
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Ginny Blundy
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« Reply #31 on: May 29, 2009, 12:15:48 am »

Not to push the point, but with earrings there is the risk of the verdigris making direct contact with the bloodstream, considering you are putting the post into a healed puncture wound. I know I've had a few earring mishaps that have resulted in bloodshed.

So that is a bit different from wearing a bracelet.

I'm not sure, but wouldn't tetanus also be a risk? Isn't getting corrosion into the bloodstream (i.e. stepping on a rusty nail) how that occurs?

Forgive me, it is my nature to be cautious. I really should take a job as a safety inspector.
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von Corax
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« Reply #32 on: May 29, 2009, 03:16:49 am »

I'm not sure, but wouldn't tetanus also be a risk? Isn't getting corrosion into the bloodstream (i.e. stepping on a rusty nail) how that occurs?

Actually, tetanus is caused by Clostridium tatani tetani, a soil-borne bacterium closely related to Clostridium botulinum (botulism) and C. difficile (the hospital superbug.) It's not the fact that the nail is rusty, but rather that it became rusty from lying on the ground. This is how it's possible to immunize against tetanus.

I have not studied biochemistry (yet — I'm only up to "astronomy" but I'll get to the "B"s eventually...) and I know there are differing opinions on the effects of chronic copper absorption at below-acutely-toxic levels, but I suspect the amount you would absorb through a ruptured piercing from an earring would be less than what you might get from drinking-water over the course of a year. A greater hazard might be that of tattooing your piercing green.

EDIT: typos...
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« Reply #33 on: June 02, 2009, 09:22:28 pm »

Have to agree that tetanus isn't due to the nail but the bacteria.  Any time you're working in the garden  any cut (from nails, thorns, glass, lawnmowers, etc) you're at risk of getting tetanus if you're not up to date (or even if you get soil on a cut).

With verdigris you would probably want to varnish it in someway anyway, not because of potential poisoning but because it has a tendancy to wear off very quickly - being soft and only loosly attached to the copper surface.

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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #34 on: June 03, 2009, 06:51:32 pm »

Been experimenting a bit, i painted on the plant food, let it go very green, then heated it when dry. It went black which is what i expected, but the black brushed easily off and under that it had made the copper pinky and very corroded looking, which might be useful for a very aged look.
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« Reply #35 on: June 05, 2009, 06:18:04 pm »

Iodine if commonly used to antigue any non-ferrous metal. It's great on brass but don't spill any on your jewelry! toma
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Miss Groves
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« Reply #36 on: June 08, 2009, 10:37:32 pm »

if you want to try something odd and bizarre without the ammonia then try this:

Hard boil some eggs.
Squish them up, shells and all in a tupperware container.
Suspend your small item/s of jewellery on wire in the container.
Squash the lid on as tight as you can and leave to age.

The natural ammonia in the eggs will gently do the same job as more harmful chemicals.
Works on copper, silver and brass.
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« Reply #37 on: June 08, 2009, 11:34:51 pm »

if you want to try something odd and bizarre without the ammonia then try this:

Hard boil some eggs.
Squish them up, shells and all in a tupperware container.
Suspend your small item/s of jewellery on wire in the container.
Squash the lid on as tight as you can and leave to age.

The natural ammonia in the eggs will gently do the same job as more harmful chemicals.
Works on copper, silver and brass.

I use this on silver quite often.  I remember my mothers expression the first time I done this on an over polished broach (she took all the patina off the sunken areas).  If I remember correctly it's only the yoke you need (you can use the whites in something else - I uses to separate the whites and yolks, cook the yolks and use the whites as hair stiffener) .

The active ingredient is the same as in stink bombs and flours of sulphur (often applied as a hot solution to metal to give a patina) but is certainly less intensive on the nasal intake than the latter two.
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vela
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« Reply #38 on: June 09, 2009, 02:45:53 am »

Vinegar. 

Personally, I would use a pen-torch.  The colours are so pretty.

-vela
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« Reply #39 on: June 09, 2009, 03:02:26 am »

if its copper, brass, or steel, a gun bluing solution will patina the copper and brass a nice brown and the steel will blue.

the bigger sporting goods stores and the sporting goods sections of the big mega stores sell it. there is even touch up markers that are basically sharpies with the bluing agent in them.

I had to machine some antiqued brass pocket door handles for my sister, touched them up with the bluing and you couldn't tell I had did anything to them.

wow, deja vu, did I say all this already?
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The Reverend Catmandoo
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« Reply #40 on: June 09, 2009, 04:46:13 am »

There is also a gun "browning", this gives steel a really nice aged look. I have used it before with quite nice results. CMD
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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #41 on: June 09, 2009, 02:00:58 pm »

if you want to try something odd and bizarre without the ammonia then try this:

Hard boil some eggs.
Squish them up, shells and all in a tupperware container.
Suspend your small item/s of jewellery on wire in the container.
Squash the lid on as tight as you can and leave to age.

The natural ammonia in the eggs will gently do the same job as more harmful chemicals.
Works on copper, silver and brass.

I use this on silver quite often.  I remember my mothers expression the first time I done this on an over polished broach (she took all the patina off the sunken areas).  If I remember correctly it's only the yoke you need (you can use the whites in something else - I uses to separate the whites and yolks, cook the yolks and use the whites as hair stiffener) .

The active ingredient is the same as in stink bombs and flours of sulphur (often applied as a hot solution to metal to give a patina) but is certainly less intensive on the nasal intake than the latter two.

The wife had a negative reaction when i slipped one of our (then) baby's wet nappies in a plastic sack and put in a brass globe i made...basically any ammonia and or sulphur will change its colour. Ammonia to green, sulphur to black/grey.
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Mina
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« Reply #42 on: June 10, 2009, 08:53:44 pm »

The wife had a negative reaction when i slipped one of our (then) baby's wet nappies in a plastic sack and put in a brass globe i made...basically any ammonia and or sulphur will change its colour. Ammonia to green, sulphur to black/grey.

sulfur... isn't that on match heads? (i'm probably wrong)

i've postponed my project, just because i've been getting so many good suggestions and I'm not sure which ones i want to try, it's amazing!
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« Reply #43 on: June 10, 2009, 09:03:06 pm »

sulfur... isn't that on match heads? (i'm probably wrong)

No, you're right. It's not just in match heads, though. Ask someone who reloads their own bullets, they should know someone who has it.
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Mina
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« Reply #44 on: June 10, 2009, 09:06:51 pm »

sulfur... isn't that on match heads? (i'm probably wrong)

No, you're right. It's not just in match heads, though. Ask someone who reloads their own bullets, they should know someone who has it.

hmmm, yes, i believe i will ask my Alzheimer's ridden great uncle next time i see him... Smiley we'll see how well that works

but would i be able to use the matches themselves is the question...
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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #45 on: June 10, 2009, 09:53:49 pm »

"...The striking surface is composed of typically 25% powdered glass, 50% red phosphorus, 5% neutralizer, 4% carbon black and 16% binder; and the match head is typically composed of 45-55% potassium chlorate, with a little sulfur and starch, a neutralizer (ZnO or CaCO3), 20-40% of siliceous filler, diatomite and glue.[9] Some heads contain antimony(III) sulfide so they burn more vigorously..." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Match)

So it might be worth a try, i got a little jar of sulphur from our local chemist, light yellow and sends copper black when heated in its surface.
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Miss Groves
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« Reply #46 on: June 11, 2009, 09:09:01 am »

i got a huge thing of sulpher when i ran out from my local garden centre.
It's sold to dust roses and things for bugs/mould etc
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sidecar_jon
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« Reply #47 on: June 11, 2009, 11:14:10 am »

i got a huge thing of sulpher when i ran out from my local garden centre.
It's sold to dust roses and things for bugs/mould etc

It seems garden centres are a a much better source of chemicals than chemists!
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The Reverend Catmandoo
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« Reply #48 on: June 17, 2009, 01:00:05 am »

Ok, here is a pic of copper tube and brass rod that have been exposed to ammonia and unaged metal for reference.
I put the ammonia, 10% ammonium hydroxide, in a large glass jar and set the metal on a plastic box. Lidded it up and timed 30 minutes. The copper was aged to the point that it matched my naturally aged copper, and the brass, you can be the judge, I like my brass shiny.
I purchased the ammonia at Ace hardware, I was there picking up more bits for my plasma cell anyway.
Just thought that you might like to see the results.
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Silas P. Morgan
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« Reply #49 on: June 28, 2009, 05:08:06 pm »

For aging Brass

(This isn't really very practical (or quick), but someone may find the information useful)

If you, or someone you knows fires black powder guns.... take the dirty cleaning patches and rub the fowling on the brass part you want aged.... This will speed up the aging process, but you have to repeat the process many times. This is not a quick method, but it will nicely discolor and age the brass over time.


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