A Geographical Organizing Of Steampunks? Is it possible?

[Captain Brandsson]

I'm the outdoorsy type, myself.

The wilderness unknown calls to me...  and the wilderness known texts me on occasion.

[Silas P. Morgan]

Sorry, I was interrupted and had to run a bunch of errands before I could finish what I wanted in the last post.....

I don't think many Steampunk get-togethers are going to be camping, but it can be done....But it does illustrate how a lot of things get accomplished (well not the huge conventions....) Someone comes up with an idea for a get-together or something, post about it, and if enough people are interested it happens.... without a lot of rules or too much fuss... (of course, the larger and grander an event is, the more people that will have to work on it..... but it can still be done...)

That was one of the things I liked about the SCA, somehow they were able to run events because everyone pitched in to make them happen..... (oh yeah... and the Newsletters... those were also fun...)

I don't think it needs to be a huge international organization with a Board of Directors, a lot of rules (other than basic common sense),Dues, and official "Ranks and Titles"... But something more loosely run, that is fun.

[Ely Von Rigby]

Believed I was attempting to assist and come up with idea's

Do let me know if you need my assistance for anything.... 


EVR

[Vancouver Air Privateer]

I think a map was mentioned somewhere....

http://brassgoggles.co.uk/bg-forum/index.php?topic=2811.0

here is a rather..emptyish BG members map...we need to get really prooactive about keeping this up.

[Silas P. Morgan]

I think another Frapper Map would be useful, but this one would be for Steampunk Groups instead of for individuals. Or a (stickied) list by Country, State, and City/location of Steampunk Groups.

With a dot for where they are (or location for a list), the group's name, and an e-mail so people could contact the group.....

[Captain Brandsson]

Perhaps there is a bit of “cart before the horse” going on, here.  The mention of the map got me thinking that assembling in small local groups is the first step.
Our loose common goal would be “instigation and promotion” as best suits the tastes and talents of each group (one may spend their time building, another LARPing, etc) and would, of course, style themselves as they see fit.
Once such groups are formed, and we have a network of sorts, we can review our assets and move forward form there.

[Dr. Munro]

I too noticed the glaringly obvious gap between having a map of groups and actually having groups.

I'm also very pleased that I've created a quotable phrase

[Captain Brandsson]

I'm also very pleased that I've created a quotable phrase

And thus you are immortal! 

[Roderick Hellyer]

Okay,

not as psychotically grumpy today  but still a way off from being in tip top shape so i beg the members indulgence for anything short in my speech.

First I want to thank everyone for there honesty in both vision and practicality.

Here's some things I don't think this can be...

1) this cannot be the SCA. Nope, they already exist and they where created after decades of trial and error as to what worked and what didn't.  Can we create something with simalr overtones, yes , can we learn from their and other groups success's ..yes.  But we cannot create from whole cloth what took decades to build overnight and trying will only lead to failure.

2) It cannot be another Camirilia because there is not one intellectual property that we all obsessively fan about to act as the lynch pin . I also think limiting this to just larping without said IP is another way to doom it to failure.

3) Renfair - nope... there's a couple of problems here... one we are not a historuical recreation completely (and yes most renfairs are not either but have history a shared illusion to wrap them and there customer base in) and I dont think we are planing a for profit endevor either.

that said...what can we be...

Something different, new and original.  An organization that coordinates people and groups to further the steampunk aesthetic through the creation of fab labs, skill circles, literature get together, costume/fashioon workshops, educational mad science for ourselves and for schools, Music groups,  and the ideas go on and on.  To do this requires work, some capital and people willing to invest there time into such a thing.  if that's where we want to go, then the next thing is to get the interested early adopters together online to hash out what the organization will be and using a non foroum client with white board capabilities and the like (Google sites is not a bad idea)


Oh and dont fall into the trap that founders or visionary's need to run things... sometimes then vcan but uselly after you get past the initial set up, you bring in people who can manage on a day to day basis.  No offense intended here but if this is to be successful it cannot be built around a cult of personality. NO bioshock rapture here thank you very much.

If this is to just be for communication and linking groups together then brass Goggles does that already and lest not try to reinvent the wheel.

but...

If this is to try to organize a society to help people apply steampunk to live better in there day to day lives then I am in.  we cannot have or live in illusions here, we must wrap ourselves in what ever illusions we choose to best survive the life we have.  Please read Bruce Sterling's Gobot keynote address http://gogbot.nl.vedor.com/thema/ its an eye opener.

respectfully

R. Hellyer

[Captain Brandsson]

Hellyer says it best.

not as psychotically grumpy today  but still a way off from being in tip top shape so i beg the members indulgence for anything short in my speech.

First I want to thank everyone for there honesty in both vision and practicality.

Again, no need.
Also, happy to do so.

1) this cannot be the SCA. Nope, they already exist and they where created after decades of trial and error as to what worked and what didn't.  Can we create something with simalr overtones, yes , can we learn from their and other groups success's ..yes.  But we cannot create from whole cloth what took decades to build overnight and trying will only lead to failure.

Agreed! I think any use as an example was just a form of “short hand” and any comparisons would be largely superficial.

2) It cannot be another Camirilia because there is not one intellectual property that we all obsessively fan about to act as the lynch pin . I also think limiting this to just larping without said IP is another way to doom it to failure.

Agreed.

3) Renfair - nope... there's a couple of problems here... one we are not a historuical recreation completely (and yes most renfairs are not either but have history a shared illusion to wrap them and there customer base in) and I dont think we are planing a for profit endevor either.

See comments regarding the SCA, above.

Something different, new and original.  An organization that coordinates people and groups to further the steampunk aesthetic through the creation of fab labs, skill circles, literature get together, costume/fashioon workshops, educational mad science for ourselves and for schools, Music groups,  and the ideas go on and on.  To do this requires work, some capital and people willing to invest there time into such a thing.  if that's where we want to go, then the next thing is to get the interested early adopters together online to hash out what the organization will be and using a non foroum client with white board capabilities and the like (Google sites is not a bad idea)

I think this sums it up best.

Oh and dont fall into the trap that founders or visionary's need to run things... sometimes then vcan but uselly after you get past the initial set up, you bring in people who can manage on a day to day basis.  No offense intended here but if this is to be successful it cannot be built around a cult of personality. NO bioshock rapture here thank you very much.

On this I cannot agree more.  I’ve seen were this sort of thing can lead. *shudder*

If this is to just be for communication and linking groups together then brass Goggles does that already and lest not try to reinvent the wheel.

but...

If this is to try to organize a society to help people apply steampunk to live better in there day to day lives then I am in.  we cannot have or live in illusions here, we must wrap ourselves in what ever illusions we choose to best survive the life we have.  Please read Bruce Sterling's Gobot keynote address http://gogbot.nl.vedor.com/thema/ its an eye opener.

Thank you for your thoughts, Hellyer.

[Captain_Sadeian]

Just to add my two-penneth in the hope that I m not stepping on any toes.

Those few who have read and enjoyed my tales, are able to join the Sydeian Research Coalition (the group the story is about). It is international in its scope having branches wherever in the world brave men and women band together to defeat aetherial menaces.

If anyone would like to join there is a link on my website at http://www.sydeian.org

Joining also signs members up to  a newsletter in which there is news not only of tales/books but also of the events and traders/makers I am involved with.

One day soon I shall describe more fully the future plans for all the wonderous fun the coalition will entail.

Your friend,

Sydeian

[Roderick Hellyer]

Captain Brandsson,

no problems here on me expressing my ideas  ... hell I come out of coma for a cup of coffee and a microphone...

Sincerely

R. Hellyer

[Yorktron]

Okay, well, if I may be so presumptuous as to assume three things:

1. A structure heavy filled organization with bylaws a la SCA is a no go for most steampunkers.
2. There is still a need/desire for some organization that will organize steampunkers geographically so we can meet each other, share information and just have a jolly good time.
3. There is a need for a kick in the proactive direction.

Re: #3, here is a proposed outline of how we can start seeing some proactive action:

Step 1: Use Frappr or manually list steampunkers who are interested in this organization by location. We can then put steampunkers into groups of no less than 5 and no more than 20. This ensures that all steampunkers have their voice heard in their local groups. I think it is important for most people that everybody has some voice in how this organization works. The local level will, hopefully, be able to meet regularly in a nice safe and public place enough times so that the following can be completed: The first couple of meetings will most likely be a lot of socializing, but there should be some discussion as to how each pocket wants the group work. You could talk about workshops that would be interesting to have, tea parties that would be fun to host, etc etc. Also, there should be some discussion about what you want the overall organization to be named, what you want your local group to be named and some basic things like that. These discussions should be enough to help each group pick out one local representative. Each local rep should check in with brassgoggles for their local group.

Step 2: Local reps get together in statewide/regional rep groups who discuss what each of their local groups had in mind (a sort of transcript may be provided for the local level). They should work on focusing the organization as a whole a little. Of the regionals, another rep will be picked so that we have a national, and then the international level. This step isn't elaborated so much because it'd be too long of a read. But every step of the way, the more local group must have some idea of what is going on at the regional, national and international level. Assuming we're all amicable and reasonable, the international group (which would be the highest level) should be able to come up with the following:
a. A name and some kind of icon/banner/flag or whathaveyou.
b. Some rules regarding what a chapter of this organization must do to be considered a member [they should, of course, be minimal]
c. A specific way for international/national/regional meetings to be called. [i.e. if 25% of the local reps want to call a meeting, a local rep meeting will be called, etc.] And other nit picky things like that. They should be called in extreme cases probably...
d. A specific way for local group to address grievances and/or reselect leaders.
e. Come up with ways to promote and give exposure to the fledgling group.
f. Interactions with preexisting steampunk groups/events
g. Other things
Most likely, the international level will be broken up by continents, but we'll see how many people are willing to get in on this idea.
All the ideas will be finalized at the international level, but they will have all been generated from the local level. After this initial set up, the international level shouldn't really be needed for much...

This is still a little vague, but I thought I'd put this out there to help people think up ideas on how they want this organization to work. This is more of a way to get people thinking up of *specific* ways to get this organization up and running rather than me taking the helm and leading people wherever I please.

I am willing to help organize the first step, but after that it's really all up to everybody who joins this endeavor. Please sound your support for this idea if you think it is good and provide polite constructive criticisms if you don't. The only thing close to this that I have experience with is starting up a local knitting club and although I've learned some things, it hasn't taught be everything. Also, this is by no means some hard, fast outline. I love getting things up and running and I think this really has a chance to pick up momentum as the organization moves from the local level to the international level.

[Captain Brandsson]

For myself, I am going to start small and local.

Make contact with wose with reach and maintain contact with those farther out.

[Eisenfaust]

For myself, I am going to start small and local.

Make contact with wose with reach and maintain contact with those farther out.

I have a tendency to agree with this for the most part.  One of the greatest stimulation and incentives that people have is the ability to come together, and share not only pictures and words but also the companionship, camaraderie, and real life experiences.  This can best be accomplished by bringing like minded groups of people together on a fairly regular basis.

Conventions, events, salons, etc are very good to spread a network of like minded people accross the country and to build lasting friendships, however, especially in this day and age, it becomes cost prohibitive to travel to central locations.  This is why such a localized, almost regional direction is needed.

The biggest problem spreading a movement or group accross the country is going to be integrating ideas into a single manifest.  Personally, I do not see this as much of a problem as there doesn't seem to be much of a push for an award system or anything besides a leadership structure that crosses lines.  It seems to me that we are discusssing a group that almost adhere to a support or interest group instead of a actual organization.  If I might, I have a few suggestions:

1.  Contact groups...knowing where people are coming from and where they might be going to.  Getting together in a social situation seems to be the glue that binds groups together.  The use of Frappr or similar technology seems the best way.

2.  Allow groups to decide their leadership in their own style.  You may have oligarchies, family groups, committees, dictatorships (enlightened of course) but in the end, let each group decide upon their own path.

3.  Do not limit the number of groups in a city.  if 5 people want to get together outside of the structure of another group in the same town, so be it.  The ultimate goal is to be able to enjoy ourselves and exchange ideas.  This should be fine, especially without a system of group growth or overall leadership.  Additionally, without awards and such, there is no real reasons not to have 20 different clubs, salons, or leagues within a township.

As I stated before, my personal opinion is one of less government and more interaction.  Coming up with a structure, having some set rules, and organizing a group is a grand ideal and one that I would happily assist in.  I have seen to many groups though get bogged down in the mire of bureaucracy, personal goals, and vendettas.  We are trying to set the stage for the golden age, no matter how dark, dire, and gritty.

[Captain Brandsson]

"{W}e get a mechanic... hire a good pilot, maybe a cook. Live like real people. A small crew. They must feel the need to be free. Take jobs as they come. They never have to be under the heel of nobody ever again."

A romantic notion, but idyllic to me right now.

[Ely Von Rigby]

Sits back and watches for signs of a next step.. 

Smiles

EVR

[Dr. Munro]

I am so going back and watching Firefly again

[Captain Brandsson]

I am so going back and watching Firefly again

Is there a steampunk version of the "high five"?

[Dr. Munro]

How about a good handshake and a light pat on the shoulder?

[Captain Brandsson]

How about a good handshake and a light pat on the shoulder?

Surely something with more...  gusto.

Perhaps a mechanical arm mounted on a... hmm...  Off to the workshop.

[Roderick Hellyer]

Hmmmmm Interesting....


just a couple of observations - politics will come , i this sucessful over time.  No need to worry about the thick laden rules book of the SCA to start, that took decades to create.  However, you or we must be wise enough to craft the intial document to be flexible enough to be added to as time goes on and yet not so ambiguous that it does not promote growth and direction.


two - I agree that starting small is a good idea, growth will occur naturally and in direct proportion to the interst of those in the groups to promoting growth.

three (and here I disagree) I must voice disagreement with Eisenfaust  as to the manner of the groups leaderships and organization. 

2.  Allow groups to decide their leadership in their own style.  You may have oligarchies, family groups, committees, dictatorships (enlightened of course) but in the end, let each group decide upon their own path.

if this organization is just to promote communication among groups then I have offer no disagreement, but if this organization intends to be a NPO (with 501c3 tax exempt status)
then there should be a two tired system. (here we can learn from the SCA) individuals that organize events, process data, and handle money should be part of a (yet undecided group) that is standardized across groups, regions, nations and internationally.  This is the most efficient way to handle repetitive tasks and positions.  For those who wish to just be participants than yes, let them create anything they like for the structure of there group...from airship armada  to various other houses and such.

now why do I suggest this rather official group structure? its easy because if your going to do anything with weird science (Tesla coils, van de graaf generators etc) or have any type of league in barjitsu or cane fighting or just a major feast in a hall you need to cove your collective ass with the right insurance policy.

so how do we get to this (which I would say is a 2nd stage phase in this endeavor) we proceed with the first stage of getting already existing  groups to discuss this, preferably online to start and then hold a meeting in rt (call it a lyceum or perhaps there is a Victorian name for a gathering of scientists or philosophers) and hash out the details. through come to think of it a first time meeting of just everyone in this thread would be a good start as well.

now this is just suggestions but if we did pull together such a group, it would convey on the smaller groups advantages that they probably could not get on there own.

ok my two cents are used up,

Respectfully

R. Hellyer

[Yorktron]

My, my, things have picked up. However, it looks as though people are moving towards starting up their own individual groups and then meeting up and people have been doing that already through this forum! Perhaps things should be left at that and let things pick up naturally from there?

[Captain Brandsson]

My, my, things have picked up. However, it looks as though people are moving towards starting up their own individual groups and then meeting up and people have been doing that already through this forum! Perhaps things should be left at that and let things pick up naturally from there?

That is an oversimplification, I am afraid.
Can't form a group of ANY size without members.

[Yorktron]

Is this a call for a member list of some sort?