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Poll
Question: It the Pagoda  / Tea house part of the Steampunk ethos
Yes [both] - 6 (85.7%)
No [both] - 1 (14.3%)
Pagoda - 0 (0%)
Tea House - 0 (0%)
Total Voters: 7

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Author Topic: Are Pagoda and Tea Houses Steampunk ??  (Read 818 times)
Hurricane Annie
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« on: August 03, 2016, 02:40:49 am »

 The  Tea House is ubiquitous across Asia and has  traveled its way across  the Western world

http://japanese-tea-ceremony.net/history.html
http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Tea_house
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chashitsu
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_house

Tea drinking is a common feature of religious ceremony in Asia. The  Pagoda temple influence  is reflected  in the architecture and ceremony of the  Asian Tea House.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pagoda
https://www.britannica.com/technology/pagoda


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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2016, 03:06:21 am »



 PAGODA



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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2016, 03:25:00 am »


 TEA HOUSE


Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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J. Wilhelm
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« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2016, 04:16:23 am »

In order to be Steampunk, there is no cultural restriction, for we have already demonstrated that many cultures, including the Japanese, have adopted Steampunk and tied it to their own history, like the Meiji Restoration period, for example.

Having said that, what specifically makes it Steampunk is who you and what you place in the pagoda or the tea house.  By themselves, the buildings are not Steampunk, not the least because they predate the industrial age by many years, even centuries, with origins well before the Edo period (the history of Japanese architecture is fascinating) , and thus neglect the adoption of the industrial technology and Western hybrid aesthetics we associate with the Meiji Period.

Perhaps if you were to make an argument for pre-industrial clockpunk, with wooden gears and mechanisms intertwined with the structures, like maybe an automaton geisha serving tea...
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Inflatable Friend
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« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2016, 09:04:32 am »

Largely in accordance with Wilhelm.

There's nothing in history that is by itself Steampunk. A steam train isn't Steampunk, nor is Isambard Kingdom Brunel or airships. But if you smush it all up so Brunel be and instrumental in creating the Great Western Airways, a vast network of steam driven airships that provide a new age of travel, trade and the brutal expansion of the British Empire. Then you'd get something fairly Steampunk.

So, pagodas and teahouses, in isolation or in history they're not inherently Steampunk, but given the right changes and setting then there's no reason at all that they couldn't be.
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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2016, 10:17:28 am »



My inspiration  for the thread had come from channeling the Opium wars, Boxer rebellion  and  the  imperial push  for expansion that led to the tea trade, missionary  out reaches and exploration expidition into exotic lands .

And all the tea drinking that would have ensued





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Angus A Fitziron
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« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2016, 11:29:31 am »

Another vote here supporting the notion that Steampunk has no cultural, racial or geographical borders - it is only limited by the imagination of the participant.

I would offer another slant though. Somebody, just by wearing motorcycle goggles and a conventional suit made from material printed with gears, is also not steampunk! The historical nod has to be included and, to my mind, tea houses and pagodas do that every bit as well as airships, steam trains and The Victoria and Albert Museum.
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Prof. Cecily
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« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2016, 12:30:48 pm »

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.
What is the steampunk ethos?

In any case, I find the various suggestions posted up here most ingenious.

I remain yours,
Prof. Cecily
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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2016, 05:40:48 pm »



Well Good time just before the dawn to you Prof. Cecily

It has turned into an interesting conversation    - with a philosophical twist.

There is much contemplation and discussion  on what is the steampunk ethos.  [ slanging matches and fisticuffs ]

Yours, Hurricane Annie.
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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2016, 05:42:29 pm »



 {... is the misuse of opiates steampunk...}
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Angus A Fitziron
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« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2016, 10:58:49 pm »

maybe stories about the mis-use of opiates but the mis-use of any drug is probably outside the accepted remit of this forum and I would be surprised if it was not outside the rules - so NO.

This thread drove me back to when I first joined this forum - 2009 - because I recalled a number of threads that debated the ethos of Steampunk, what is SP, is SP nature or nurture and so on. It is interesting to read comments from long standing brassgogglers who no longer post or are infrequent posters. Worth a look!
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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2016, 12:44:20 am »

maybe stories about the mis-use of opiates but the mis-use of any drug is probably outside the accepted remit of this forum and I would be surprised if it was not outside the rules - so NO.

This thread drove me back to when I first joined this forum - 2009 - because I recalled a number of threads that debated the ethos of Steampunk, what is SP, is SP nature or nurture and so on. It is interesting to read comments from long standing brassgogglers who no longer post or are infrequent posters. Worth a look!

I will just say that the misuse use of pharmaceuticals is never ok and I have seen  the damage 1st hand in loved ones.  I was being  facetious   about commonly asked queries and polls on BG [including my own  ]

Though one might need a cup of tea and a lie down  after  engaging in vigorous  debate on BG  as to what is steampunk  and  ABSOLUTELY is not.
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chironex
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« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2016, 10:47:47 am »

If Asian peoples can feature as characters in Steampunk/VSF/AMF, and they do, as well as in historical fiction and gaslamp Fantasy/Weird Western, then their culture and architecture will appear with them. While the average Chinese worker building the railroads across the US wouldn't be too familiar with such things, some immigrants may have had enough to start their own businesses, including tea houses. A character like Warlord Kang of Deadlands would certainly have a pagoda in his garden. Then there is an entire faction in Malifaux - the Ten Thunders. There is actually a whole range of scenic features available for them, including many things you would expect to find in a traditional garden in a Kung Fu movie.

maybe stories about the mis-use of opiates but the mis-use of any drug is probably outside the accepted remit of this forum and I would be surprised if it was not outside the rules - so NO.

It was still a thing, even featuring in literature of the time. Opium dens could be another seedy side to a den of scum and villainy in any steam-era story.
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« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2016, 06:50:57 pm »

I say they can be Steampunk.  Viewed alone they aren't, but introduced in the right context they can be made so. 

How many country houses in the UK, for example, have them in their grounds as follies or garden pavilions?- and why is this?- because the period between around 1700 and around 1900 was the era when worldwide travel really became possible, and you find the wealthy types going off on tour and coming back bringing foreign customs and styles with them. 

   

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Hurricane Annie
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« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2016, 05:25:44 am »



 The pagoda /  tea house thing would fit in with the whole intrepid age of steam travel.  Bearing in mind also that steam engines were  discovered in Asia  over 2000 years ago and used for novelty   and entertainment  value .
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Prof. Cecily
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« Reply #15 on: August 06, 2016, 07:58:53 am »

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.
I say they can be Steampunk.  Viewed alone they aren't, but introduced in the right context they can be made so. 

How many country houses in the UK, for example, have them in their grounds as follies or garden pavilions?- and why is this?- because the period between around 1700 and around 1900 was the era when worldwide travel really became possible, and you find the wealthy types going off on tour and coming back bringing foreign customs and styles with them.  



And the exhibitions! Let's not  forget the museum lectures and exhibitions and travel literature which the middle classes devoured.

I remain yours,
Prof. Cecily
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