The Ignorance of Commoners Reaches New Heights

[Hyeronymus Amphigourias]

There seems to be some little confusion here between ignorance and stupidity - ignorance can be remedied but against stupidity the Gods themselves rail in vain.

It would depend on your definition of stupidity. To my opinion, stupidity is just a willingness to not overcome ignorance. In french we would say "You can't oblige a donkey which is not thirsty, to drink" (I am not quite sure of the translation here...)
My point is, I have stupid students. I first need to deal with their stupidity, then with their ignorance... With a little practice, it is feasible because curiosity is not the archenemy of ignorance but of stupidity. So I have to make them curious first. Then to deal with ignorance is just technical stuff. The artistic part of a teacher 's job is the first one

[von Adler]

In french we would say "You can't oblige a donkey which not thirsty, to drink" (I am not quite sure of the translation here...)

I believe the equivalent English saying is "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink".

[Violet Rose]

There seems to be some little confusion here between ignorance and stupidity - ignorance can be remedied but against stupidity the Gods themselves rail in vain.

It would depend on your definition of stupidity. To my opinion, stupidity is just a willingness to not overcome ignorance.

I would say that stupidity is the inability to learn or understand -

[Utini420]

It isn't the ignorance of folks that bother me, its the way so damned many of them cling to their ignorance like a virtue.  Possibly the clearest example of this were the girls in school (you all know the type) who will, on occasion, let the mask slip and reveal that their brain in fact functions; but as soon as their friends are back in the room they turn stupid to be popular.  Adults do it too, though.  The more important an issue is, the more resistant people become to understanding its causes, it seems.  In extreme instances this leads them to not only avoid education for themselves, but work to deny or degrade it to others.  Intelligent Design morons, I'm looking at you, and the company you keep.

And I'm afraid this trend is getting worse.  Willful ignorance is but one facet of the culture at large's growing disdain of anything that requires effort.   These are the same fools who see art and make comments like, "Someone had too much free time."  I want to smack people who say that.

[Hyeronymus Amphigourias]

There seems to be some little confusion here between ignorance and stupidity - ignorance can be remedied but against stupidity the Gods themselves rail in vain.

It would depend on your definition of stupidity. To my opinion, stupidity is just a willingness to not overcome ignorance.

I would say that stupidity is the inability to learn or understand -

More than "inability" it is the "active" attitude toward ignorance that would, for me, define stupidity. Pretty much as Utini is saying just above :

It isn't the ignorance of folks that bother me, its the way so damned many of them cling to their ignorance like a virtue.

My own definition of stupidity exactly... But everyone carries its own definition (naming the world to understand it, isn't it?) I am not sure the debate should become too semiological

[Elliot_Pending]

These are the same fools who see art and make comments like, "Someone had too much free time."  I want to smack people who say that.

Bleh, yeah.

Like every one of them is doing anything at all useful with their time. Halo and alcoholism do not count as a worthwhile expenditure of time.

[Herr Klinger]

In french we would say "You can't oblige a donkey which not thirsty, to drink" (I am not quite sure of the translation here...)

I believe the equivalent English saying is "You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink".

The way I've heard it, "You can lead a horticulture but you can't make it think". Plant biology humor, more or less.

I just got off of the phone with a technical support person with less technical knowledge than myself on the given problem. I wouldn't call him stupid or anything, it's just a shame that corporations cheap out rather than give actual knowledgeable folk well paying jobs. It's easy to label other people as the 'unwashed masses', but in reality I believe people as a whole are a lot better than one is lead to believe. Stinky old mass media and it's paranoia machine!

Sorry if that is deemed political.

Edit: Those TV shows where on-the-street people get ridiculous answers always get me, too. I honestly think for a few seconds of fame many people will answer with some foolish answer guaranteed to get them on the air. Perhaps I think too highly of others, but I sincerely hope not.

[Sgt.Major Thistlewaite]

Comment: Two of society's greatest problems are ignorance and apathy.

Response: Huh! Well, I don't know, and I couldn't care less!

 

[popuptoaster]

Its not hard to edit the right answers out of a TV show and leave the funny, wrong ones in when its broadcast.

[von Corax]

Comment: Two of society's greatest problems are ignorance and apathy.

Response: Huh! Well, I don't know, and I couldn't care less!

 

Yeah, it's a problem, all right, but what ya gonna do?

(Actually, I have no particular problem with ignorance; it's willful and deliberate ignorance that makes me need to go away and be alone for a while.)

[Violet Rose]

Of course we can all have our own definitions of any word as Humpty Dumpty does in Alice  but being old fashioned I generally go by the (Chambers) dictionary definition:
"stupid:stupified or stunned;senseless,insensible, deficient or dull in understanding,showing lack of reason or judgement;foolish;dull;boring.
 stupidity n
which seems to indicate an innate inability to understand or reason than laziness or lack of curiosity

[Capt. Dirigible]

It isn't the ignorance of folks that bother me, its the way so damned many of them cling to their ignorance like a virtue.

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

Dean Vernon Wormer (Faber College)

[Burr]

I try not to judge people on these things too harshly. Some people have an interest in science or history, others prefer different ways to spend their time. I have known some highly skilled craftsmen that knew nowt about politics, simply because they occupied their time in other ways. I don't think they are a bad person or stupid because of it. They were pleasant enough and clearly had skill and imagination from what I saw them produce.

Different strokes for different folks.

[Utini420]

I've commented on ignorance, willful or otherwise.  But there's another axis here, and due to terminology we're sort of blurring them.

You've got  one axis that goes ignorant <----------> knowledgeable.  Its tempting to call stupid those ignorant of areas in which you are knowledgeable, but as many have said that may just be an interest level thing.  If we were talking about football, I'd look like a moron.  This is an important distinction, but I think this "single-axis model of stupidity" fails to adequately describe the problem. 

There's a second axis, 90' perpendicular to the first, which can be described as, idiotic <------------> clever.  Where the first axis describes the presence or lack of existing knowledge, this second axis describes the rate at which new skills, concepts, and information can be grasped.  Does the individual learn new skills and "take on board," new mental stuff rapidly or slowly?  'Cause some folks, you gotta explain it to them really slowly, connecting each dot for them, possibly several times.

A third possible axis exists, but is harder to quantify.  Again 90' from the other axes, this axis my be defined as, booring <----------->brilliant, serves to describe the intellectual creativity of an individual, how well they take part of the problem and figure out the rest; apply existing knowledge and skills in a way other than their original use; generate new concepts by combining pieces of existing concepts.

That idea has been rattling around in my head for a while, but I've never really put it down like that.  I think I will call it the "Multi-Axis Model of Stupidity."  That makes a nice acronym, too.

[chicar]

I don't really meet stupid people (perhaps because i'm the resident idiot most of the time   ), but i pretty annoyed by the common confusion betwen roman antiquity, the middle age,the rennaissance\baroque age and the industrial revolution.  At the head of many people,it like the middle age began with the founding of Rome and ended in 1918.
 
No, Americas wasn't colonised during the middle age. Neither Jesus was born on this period.

No, Raspoutine, Samuel de Champlain and King Arthur wasn't contemporary.

I mean there obvious esthetic difference at first sight.

Ignorance is not synonymous with stupidity, but gosh it reach height higher than the common mentally challenged.

[Gentleman-Adventurer]

Its not hard to edit the right answers out of a TV show and leave the funny, wrong ones in when its broadcast.

Except if it's Q.I.

All my life, I've come across to people as being an incredibly knowledgeable person, purely because I read a lot as a child. My parents tell me, and I find this to be a bit of a stretch, that I learned to read at the age of three. Regardless, I used to make allusions to people I read about in school, and get nothing but a blank stare. The point I'm trying to make is this: you can't really look down on someone for being ignorant of something they have never encountered in their life before. Fair enough, you can jibe and taunt away at those who really should know better, but if someone who hasn't gone near a history book in all their life has never heard of Kit Carson or General Sir Hugh Gough, then it's only to be expected. By all means, point towards a book, or tell them about them.

The fact is, knowledge is not a privilege, it's a right. It's a joy. There are people who choose to neglect it, and they are fools. However, remember Sherlock Holmes. He knew what he needed to know, much like what Burr just said.

[aquafortis]

I think we've hit the nail squarely on the head here, there's a lot of people out there who think it's cleverer to piss on someone else's efforts than it is to try to understand it. I've always tried to avoid being like this, as I've found time and time again there are a lot of people out there at least as smart as myself and I can learn something good from each and every one. Sometimes my head hurts from it, but in a good way, like muscles aching when you've shoveled ten tons of crap, intellectually speaking.

Actively not wanting to know, and actively denying engagement with the thoughts and ideas of others is the most depressing aspect of human intellect i can find, and probably reponsible for a great deal more evil than anyone would imagine.

[Vancouver Air Privateer]

It's right that different people have different levels of knowledge based on interest. But it's important to know, well, something. As a more specific point, going to a rather reputable college, I'm surprised at the lack of knowledge on History, Literature and Geography in particular. I guess it makes sense, in a sad way, that these don't really apply to many jobs today. But it's knowledge that makes you appreciate humanity and the world as a whole... which is rather frightening...

Stupidity can prevent you from building a society, ignorance can prevent you from escaping one... 

[dman762000]

Ignorance is simply  a lack of knowledge. You can't blame someone for not knowing something, they just haven't learned it yet.

We have a different word around her that derives from ignorant, it is the word  "ignernt", as in " Quit bein' ignernt, ya stupid moron".
It is usually used in reference to someone who is ignorant and yet displays this ignorance as if it is intelligence. These are the worst kind of people, they act like genius when in fact the only thing they have managed to invent or create is flatulance. You cannot teach these kind of people because they already think they know everything. Unfortunatly it seems as if the number of ignernt people are on the rise these days.

[patron_vectras]

Ignorance is simply  a lack of knowledge. You can't blame someone for not knowing something, they just haven't learned it yet.

 Indeed, Ignorance is a lack of knowledge and stupidity is having knowledge but deigning not to use it; but, you can blame someone for being ignorant in many cases. They have not taken the initiative to educate themselves upon a subject important enough to draw ire. Either that, or since acquiring the knowledge they have let the mind misplace or misrepresent it.

 People you meet on the street that feign ignorance or actually suffer with it should be reprimanded for whatever actions they pursue. Not being able to pass citizenship tests, chasing political arguments without resources, and pretending to be less than you are for any reason less than self-defense are all despicable in my opinion.



 Should, though it is rare that I should get the nerve up!
One time I did, though. I was flying from Erie, PA, to BWI through Cleveland or Philly or somesuch- sometime earlier this year. I had arrived at the gate with time to spare and began looking for a seat at which to read my book. When I perused the line of black and silver chairs I was shocked to find at least four of them choked with luggage. Carry-on, children's backpacks, and even a dog-crate! Upon inquiring the surrounding fliers, it was found the owner was not present.
 In an airport...
 Unaccompanied luggage...
 The speakers sound and re-sound the warnings concerning such and the consequences!
 All the time!
 In EVERY AIRPORT IN AMERICA!

 Using my better judgement, I made sure to determine the luggage was a minimal threat with testimony from witnesses of the perpetrator(ess). I was supplied a seat down the row and struck up conversation.

 You could feel the tenseness in the people sitting nearby...

 When the lady returned with her children and dog, I realized once again my minor aversion to face-to-face public confrontation, but took the seat of my pants for a ride and rose to address her. (Her unstated ethnicity may become the context of another reply) Taking her aside, I reminded her of the state of the Union and such and of her need to set an example for her children. She wasn't happy. I hope everyone else was quite satisfied.



 It's good to tell people that story. Seldom does the tale surface in common conversation.

[Utini420]

Unspecified ethnicity aside, I'm not sure how well I'd have responded to someone taking me aside and reminding me of the state of the union or whatever. 

[Burr]

So someone left a bag on a seat and you had a good old moan about it? If they were gone long or no where to be seen. I'd just lift the bags down and park myself on the seat (although I'd give priority to anyone else who needed the seats more than I). Can't expect people to stand and wait for something inanimate. Wouldn't be the first time I've done it either. People seem to expect their bags to get a seat on trains too. Simple as that. No need to make a big issue of it.

[patron_vectras]

Yeah, I see that usually its no big deal.

But sometimes people worry for themselves and others.
That traveler state people get in has a 'just gotta get home' mode, and when anyone sticks a wrench into carefully laid plans of egress one wonders if one is in the wrong place at the wrong time.

The careful suffer the careless.
Do you know?

EDIT:
I suppose it should be noted that the story is about HER not ME.
I'll tone down the storyteller next time.

[Atterton]

I´m assuming that story is about bomb scares, rather than not being able to get a seat.

[Hyeronymus Amphigourias]

Of course we can all have our own definitions of any word as Humpty Dumpty does in Alice  but being old fashioned I generally go by the (Chambers) dictionary definition:
"stupid:stupified or stunned;senseless,insensible, deficient or dull in understanding,showing lack of reason or judgement;foolish;dull;boring.
 stupidity n
which seems to indicate an innate inability to understand or reason than laziness or lack of curiosity

It is the "innate" I would disagree with. I think everything is acquired from different ways and for different reasons. Except pathological cases, of course, that I am not discussing here. I do believe that in the right environment (or paradigm) everyone is able to abandon stupidity. Then we would just have to treat ignorance through education which is purely a technical question (and costs a lot of money also...).
Please excuse my very synthetic answers as english is not my native language. I am doing my best, I promise. Merci!